Non-magickal initiatory experience

[BrotherM]

hey,

How many of you have had non-magickal initiatory experiences? I am not talking about generally learning lessons in life, but events that make you change the make up of the way that you think?

I have been doing magick for so long that I had become desensitised to the power of path working and the initiatory experience that comes from being exposed to the spirit worlds. I just supposed that everybody could relate to those feelings. But then on the weekend I had a totally non-magickal initiatory experience where I completely reversed my views on a subject, at a deep emotional level, in a very short time frame.

wierd,

BrotherM

[Radiant Star]

I suppose any situation or event can change the way you think about things really. Its is probably that in our subconscious we take in many ideas, experiences and eventually there is a moment of enlightenment as we make sense, or rather a different sense of things.

People often say that an illness or some major life event like having a child can trigger a new sense of what life means.

[BrotherM]

so... what happened to you?

[m1thr0s]

well I've had a few bubbles burst if that counts for anything. It can happen pretty suddenly too so that would seem like an initiatory experience I guess. Gambling comes to mind in my case, though it's been many years since this happened. I went through a thing many years ago where it finally hit me what they mean when they say "the only way to win is not to play the game"... It took being completely wiped out at the worst possible time for me to finally acknowledge this but after that I was totally changed. I have exactly no interest in gambling anymore and it's got nothing to do with the games...the industry itself is completely dominated by scum...that's all.

It's not even worth winning in that setting since it just makes the scum look good...

pretty mundane awakening but powerful and pretty much permanent in my case.

m1thr0s

[Copuldaemon]

hey,

How many of you have had non-magickal initiatory experiences? I am not talking about generally learning lessons in life, but events that make you change the make up of the way that you think?

I have been doing magick for so long that I had become desensitised to the power of path working and the initiatory experience that comes from being exposed to the spirit worlds. I just supposed that everybody could relate to those feelings. But then on the weekend I had a totally non-magickal initiatory experience where I completely reversed my views on a subject, at a deep emotional level, in a very short time frame.

wierd,

BrotherM

Well I like to believe that what it takes for this kind of awakening is atmosphere. Having the right one can provide the right mind frame to have this realization; in eventual time.

[feranaja]

Although I have personally undergone two formal, ritualized initiations, the first in particular very powerful, I'd have to say it's these so-called mundane awakenings that have proved most transformative over the long run,in my own life. There really have been two kinds in my experience; first, the ones that unravel slowly, over time and bring one into a new perspective by degrees; it's only in retrospect we see just how much we've been affected. For me the two experiences that functioned in my psyche in this way were illness, which lasted seven years, and analysis, which lasted five (Jungian). Just this morning I was reflecting on that time, when I was isolated, very ill, and spending every nickel I had on analysis. I was ostracized by others as crazy, "weak" and so on, but in fact it was the time I felt closest to God in my entire life. And I emerged from the other end a different person. When I met former acquaintances they all commented on how changed I was. It was a slow awakening, I suppose you could say that just living and getting older might have brought about a similar ripening of thought and wisdom, but in my case it was pretty accelerated. During that whole seven years I mainly read, studied nature (directly,as I was living in the woods) meditated, practised specific magickal techniques and worked the analysis. Materially I was miserable but, not surprisingly, it's a time I look back to now with great nostalgia. The illness, however wretched it was (and it was, believe me) had a silver lining in that it gave me all this time to immerse myself in my studies. I consider it an initiation,allright.


A smaller but equally potent initiation occurred more recently when a series of Internet attacks, which occurred on multiple levels, enlightened me as to the existence of evil in the world. It broke some of my optimistic illusion that deep down, everyone is actually good, fair, and reasonable, it's just that some have been more damaged than others. Evil does exist, and good does not always prevail. Maybe sounds silly coming from someone of my age, but I was convinced until only recently that evil was "relative"...and banal, not demonic. I was wrong. And the full on confrontation with it has changed me - you bet it has.

The second sort of worldly initiation I've experienced is sudden - immediate, life altering, a resounding thunderclap of the spirit ; one barely recognizes oneself in the aftermath. I've been through this one twice now, and both were sudden, tragic deaths of my nearest and dearest. Both very nearly killed me. And perhaps significantly, the first one plunged me into a frenzied pursuit of all things material (health, beauty, money and so on) while the second has tuned my perspective inward once again. I won't go on about the details but suffice to say that both these deaths were so severe in the pain they caused that I was forced to find methods of coping that would enable me to carry on living. This last one, coinciding with the confrontation with Evil, has taught me that love is the only rational act of a lifetime,and taught me to live with and stay tuned to that struggle, to practise the wound of love. I don't expect to EVER experience any such equivalent awakening again.

At least I hope not, I've had enough transformation for one lifetime, lol.

Speaking strictly from personal experience, I'll say this; formal ritualized initiations can be very powerful, particularly in those rare instances where the Initiator is a highly evolved spiritual master. However, I have met many, many individuals who possess several of these degrees, and yet do not display any of the hallmarks of what I consider a true Initiate; humility, kindness, warmth, self mastery, expansive mind. Ritualized Initiation may be transformative, it certainly brings you into the specific contacts of a group if it's properly done. But it's these larger life initiations that really count, IMHO. They often come from suffering, but also from the attitude, the response of the individual - pain, illness, loss is not always transformative as we know, it can simply embitter or depress people. Part of the challenge is to not allow that to happen. I think anytime we smile into the abyss, the abyss has no choice but to smile back at us.

feranaja

[Anibis]

I have always trusted the mundane awakenings, but to be honest, for me the mundane IS the magickal... I suppose that's the thing. I can think of a couple different events that were not formaly ritualistic, and a few that were. For example, I did two Degrees in University. I considered them to be Initiations... I always went to convocation and both times 'framed' the ritual that they do there (Which is quite Masonic, I think) with some meaningful actions on my part. For undergrad I juggled clubs before and after the ceremony, and for my Masters, I performed a special shuffle called a Faro four times on a new deck before the ceremony, and another four times on that deck after the ceremony.... just to mark the time...
-Anibis

[feranaja]

Good point Ibis, I was thinking after I posted, these "initiations" are magickal, most profoundly so...I'd rather call them "Non-ritualized Initiatory experiences" maybe?

fera

[Anibis]

Yes, or even 'para-ritualism', if you like; making a ritual out of mundanities, or for that matter turning mundane rituals into true magickal operations...

-Anibis

[Anibis]

The other day I encountered someone who 'doesn't believe in magic'.... which got me thinking. You know, I ONLY believe in Magick.. I guess that put's 'non-magickal experiences in the cold'... okay, well I am still a little zorked from boozing last night, and I have an audition... wish me luck!
-Anibis

[feranaja]

Best of luck Anibis! Take some magnesium and a good, non-yeast=based B complex to steady your nerves if you've been boozing. A tryptophan ruch meal can help too, but can also backfire and make you sleepy - and we don't want that.

Im exhausted from 16 hour days, wondering if I will soon have an "Ordeal-by-Work" mystical, initiatory experience...or just collapse, lol.

Let us know how you do...

fera

[m1thr0s]

good luck Anibis...

m1thr0s

[Anibis]

Audition went well. Looks like I will be involved in some midnight cabaret shows both planning and performing... This is the life... gonna be a saucy mind-reader! We just finished a 3 day run of my first full length show which I both produced and directed... It sold out the last two nights of the run, and will be re-mounted in a month or so, bigger and better!
-Anibis

[Anibis]

The latter was one of the biggest milestones of my career so far, and is certainly an initiatory experience. I think the pathworking helped too!
-Anibis

[Kain]

Sounds great Anibis, and certainly of the initiatory experience kind...very good to hear it went well...

Kain

[MythMath]

Very nice... :yes:

And more where that came from... ;)

[m1thr0s]

wow...that's smokin' Anibis...coolbeans...

m1thr0s

[Radiant Star]

It sold out the last two nights of the run, and will be re-mounted in a month or so, bigger and better!
Excellent, hope you enjoy this new stage in your life : )

[fr.novumorganum]

hey wonderful news---and often such news is the result of an initiation.

of course, i'd have to mention the certain drug-experiences here, but for me there is not much separation between the psychedelic state and the magickal state.

the final steps of my phd work also fits the bill here, i believe. the process of the oral exam and then the dissertation defense: sitting in a room being grilled at close distance by three 'high priests' of the profession; being led into a waiting room while they decided my fate; a door opens and asked to return to the room in which the high priests are now standing but greet me, for the first time, as a member of the profession--- i felt as high at this point as i did in either my minerval or my 1st.....trial and feast :rofl:...

[BrotherM]

What made me start this thread is that I am a petrol head, I love cars, the bigger the V8 the better, I love the sound. My favourate car is a Ferrari GTO... man, I love them. I love V8s so much I built one myself by hand a few years ago (40 series short wheelbase landcruiser with a 5.7 litre V8)

Anyway, a friend just bought a very quick car (M3 CSL for those who know cars) and we went for a ride and I hated it, I hated every second, it was scary in a "I'm going to be in a wheelchair" type of way. When I got home I had a personal dilema, I love cars, but I hate cars... GAH! I was going to buy a TVR Cerbera next year but have now given up that ambition. I suppose I am growing up...

BrotherM

[Fio Praeter Humanus]

now standing but greet me, for the first time, as a member of the profession-

Was it like that scene from that movie, Spies Like Us?

You know,
Doctor.
Doctor.
Doctor.
Doctor.

[fr.novumorganum]

:laugh::yes::laugh:

it really was

[Aodh]

Losing my virginity definitely was a sort of initiatory experience in that it totally changed the way I view sex, relationships, and myself. I've changed quite a bit of how I live since then.

The other experience that immediately comes to mind would probably be going to California last year; it was one of the most profoundly eye-opening experiences I've ever had. It just made me realize there is so much more to the world than what I've seen and what I think I'm stuck with and it also made me feel a renewed love and connection for nature and this planet we live on.

[Radiant Star]

Having children is a big life view changing experience. It certainly hones up the ability to plan for events and definitely forces one to think about whats happening in the world, locally, nationally and internationally like nothing else can.

Specific experiences are hard to remember, but have a child in danger of some kind and that will always change the way you go forward, usually permanently.

[Frater SI]

Ricci I will have to Second you There Kids change you so much. My reasoning for abandoning the dark continent and moving to Europe .. Oh yes and my Divorce "Having my balls removed through my wallet" that was also something I will not go through again