Time and Existence

[Ci Celli Ddu]

Consciousness exists also on a quantum level, a level that is not tied to Time and Space. As I understand it, this implies that an aspect of our conscious selves exists outside of time.

I'm (currently) of the opinion that the movement of Time that we experience is true Transmigration: the mind moves from moment to moment -occupying a new body with each moment as it were- but the moments we have left behind continue to exist in what we refer to as the past. The reasoning here is that movement backwards in Time has been scientifically proven to be possible, and this obviously implies that the past exists. It then follows that if the past exists, then we too exist in the past, yet obviously we only perceive ourselves in the present.

I'm currently finding some interesting parallels in Robert Bruce's Astral Dynamics, both regarding OBE projection and (what he terms) the 'mind-splits' it involves, as they correlate with my thinking on our double existence inside and outside of Time. By moving from moment to moment we are experiencing a perpetual 'mind-split', but whereas in Bruce's example of an OBE, the mind's "master copy" remains in the physical body while the "projected copy" flits through "subtle" (non-physical or astral) bodies, in my example the physical "master copy" itself is a projected copy that flits through 'temporal' bodies (ie moments), and the true 'master copy' resides outside of Time.

Or maybe I'm talking out of me arse.

[m1thr0s]

wow...well that's some pretty intense flatulence then...

I haven't read this book so I am at a disadvantage that way. I am curious how a projection outside of time would be able to maintain any kind of stability. I am also curious what happens if we start tampering with this mechanism such as projecting higher order selves and so on...

not a lot of ideas on this yet. Will need to mull it all over.

m1thr0s

[Ci Celli Ddu]

I haven't read this book so I am at a disadvantage that way. I am curious how a projection outside of time would be able to maintain any kind of stability. I am also curious what happens if we start tampering with this mechanism such as projecting higher order selves and so on...


Well, as to what I'm refering to in the book is basically the premise that during Astral projection, instead of the subject's mind vacating its physical body the mind 'splits', the master copy staying in the physical body and the projection taking a seperate copy. If the returning astral mind successfully downloads its memory into the master copy then the subject will remember his OBE, whereas otherwise the memory is lost and he will assume that the projection never happened. I'm not suggesting projecting outside of time, or back in time, though these possibilities inevitably arise. Rather Im saying that we already exist outside of time on a quantum level, and that what we perceive as being the present is like a perpetual mind-split process. But the analogy with Bruce only goes so far.

But now that you mention it, if we were to project ourselves outside of time, we would I believe inevitably experience feedback from our extra-temporal selves. I believe I may have accidently experienced something similar when I passed out briefly once, because I lucidly experienced a moment of my own future which subsequently became reality. But then, come to think of it, this could also be described as a projection forward in time, hmmm. This whole subject is a limitless source of mental candy :laugh:

[fr.novumorganum]

This reminds me of yet another of Robert Anton Wilson's ideas in Cosmic Trigger---he postulates something very similar, that much of the communication we receive from so called higher beings and magickal workings is really communication with a future, or more advanced, version of ourselves.


Of course RAW ruminates over many theories, but it may be worth looking at for this inquiry.

[m1thr0s]

But now that you mention it, if we were to project ourselves outside of time, we would I believe inevitably experience feedback from our extra-temporal selves.right...and one has to consider whether or not a projection of self constrained by time projects outside of time at all...though it is still possible that we may do this and promptly rewrite the script at the point of assimilation. It strikes me that something of this nature may be occurring all the time. One of the things that happens in trance states (however they may be induced) is that the assimilation mechanism is temporarily dismantled to one extent or another. Whenever this occurs, splinters of *timeless* self-observation slip in. As a rule we cannot seem to take very much of this at once but it may account for why and how people keep running up against this whole *higher self* experience at all...

Human beings may be the only animal on earth routinely projecting outside of time (on the out-take) only to reconstruct within time (on the in-take). Certain mental disorders, certain drug experiences, certain concentration disciplines may all have in common the fact that they interrupt the in-take in various ways, producing what we then typically define as a *psychosis*...a very broad term really that spans a huge range of psychic-energy interactions...

m1thr0s

[Ci Celli Ddu]

To add a few details to the experience I mentioned, which from my perspective lasted only a few moments, but which observing friends said was roughly two minutes, once I was in my own future I was no longer aware of how I had arrived there, of where I should be, in short of any temporal shift at all. The future scene was one of me awaking briefly in bed in the middle of the night, but in a specific location with very specific details as to my surroundings that could not in combination have been reproduced by mere coincidence, nor did I eventually arrive at this situation in real time through any effort conscious or otherwise to replicate these details. This scene became a reality roughly five months later.

As a rule we cannot seem to take very much of this at once but it may account for why and how people keep running up against this whole *higher self* experience at all...

Ive long considered the Higher Self to be an extemporal self. It seems to me to be logical.

[Anibis]

Ive long considered the Higher Self to be an extemporal self. It seems to me to be logical.

This is my working theory also... Also a sense of the self as allied to a complex higher dimensional structure that intersects the 3d world and 'warps it's countours' in certain ways... Our 'future' is revisible on this level as well...
-Anibis

[Frater CaO]

Oh this is a quite interesting thread indeed!
I agree with most of what you wrote about Consciousness existing and changing every moment that pass.
I believe that we have somewhat "Multiple Consciousness'", maybe as a result of this constant "change" or "progress" through Time. I dont know how many "Multiple Consciousness'" we might have, havent really got so far in this yet.
I also think that our "Static Consciousness", the "foundation", or "First Consciousness" exists in Chaos.
To clarify that a little I believe that Chaos is the essence of everything and it is from the Chaos that the Cosmos or Universe was once created.
So, I think that we can learn to "tap" into the essence of the Chaos and maybe this is also somehow connected to the Subconscious as well.
Well, we will certainly see about all of this in time, I think that it is inevitable that science will "soon" prove how more of this is correlating. Maybe through the Quantum techniques or string-theory or something.

/HS!