A Strange Question....

[Nine_Days_Hung]

First, let me say that I find the information here endlessly fascinating. I've not posted because, as with all things, I want have something to contribute and right now I am very much in a learning phase.

But I do have an unrelated question. I'll probably not post this on OF because I don't have time to review a lot of nonsense mixed in with a few good replies...(not sure if it belongs here...please feel free to move it.)

Perhaps my dearest friend, a witch of 20 years, was talking with another mutual friend who is a correspondence member of a GD temple.

To make a long story short, several mid-level members are said to have simply dropped off years worth of work with their proteges, or students, or whatever the correct term might be, and simply say..."I'm done." Alledgedly, the top twelve or thirteen members of this particular order are said to have disappeared and nobody has heard anything of them.

My friend said that this gave her chills and she takes it to be a sign that "something big" is going on. She adds to this the idea that several people she is familiar with have seemed to "lose their power" and are quite miserable (myself included in this to some extent.) To calm her worries, I mentioned that the several rather adept people I am familiar with online seem to still be intact, and that they seem to be "business as usual".

I'm just really curious, more than apprehensive...has anyone heard of anything similar to this, or is it an isolated incident or perhaps even an "urban legend" of sorts? The person relaying the story seemed sincere and rattled, but you just never can be sure.....

Thanks for your attention and time on this. I am guessing that any answers will be a resounding "no", but I needed to check this out....:o_O:

By the way, thanks for all your effort and time invested in making this site and the information it contains available.

Peace,
9DR

[fr.novumorganum]

well, that has all the sound of an occult urban legend, however, i could also imagine that to be a weakness of the order. perhaps this order is/was simply an occult diploma mill, simply there to rack up fees etc. a few more details would help.

but no, i have not noticed adepts disappearing, except for the passing of RAW into the astral.

[MythMath]

In a recent post Apopheros reported that the last fullmoon
seemed to adversely affect himself and some cohorts...

[Anibis]

It reminds me a bit of people I have know who have dramatically gone 'Religious' or something.... Feels to me like certain ways of being are susceptible to it. Those with a need for a belief system, maybe... It's almost a form of suicide... The trouble with metaphysical narratives; their weakness seems to be that they are sometimes incompatible with experienced realities, or other systems one might encounter, and so dramatic 'breaks' are liable to occur when various tendencies in a person or social space come into conflict... Well, it sounds like it might be something to do with the GD group in question. IT would be all to easy to link that story with all sorts of incidental stuff in order to concoct a scary Rapture-like tale... I dunno... might be worth looking into that particular group, though...
-Anibis

[m1thr0s]

That's an interesting story 9DH...serious practitioners of any consciousness art would be extremely hesitant to drop their students in mid-stride...

But there are some serious changes in the wind...the magick of the future may not bear that close a resemblance to the magick of the past. There will always remain a thread of recognition insofar as the best of the past is always carried over into the best of the future but many very core approaches to things are likely to change...and some of these changes are going to be pretty major...

So situations such as you describe might happen for perfectly natural and correct reasons. Our commitments to traditions become null & void once we become clearly aware of real and present threats to ourselves and/or our students. One always has to keep pace with the universe itself and if she slams the pedal to the floor...well...you either pick it up or get rolled right over...

More details would help though...it's almost impossible to venture too much speculation in this immediate situation. Very curious though...

m1thr0s

[deviadah]

Yes, more details please...

I suspect, as with any group, be it occult or book club or whatever, people grow up/out and move on towards other horizons. Only the truly passionate remain.

Passion is a double edged sword, or so they say, but I tend to disagree... there is nothing more enjoyable than being wrapped up in ones passion (especially if it is a healthy one like studying something like the occult for instance).

Another theory is that a lot of people that move into the occult/esoteric/wicca/new age (etc) are just searching for some spiritual guidance. Now the occult demands quite a bit from the searching individual for it to have some sort of lasting effect... religion demands very little... just throw a buck in the bucket once in a while :p

What I mean is it is easier to turn towards God, than to search for a God within, especially if this person is spiritually weak to begin with!

Oh, and another theory is 2012... but I can't be asked to go into that now!

[Nine_Days_Hung]

Interesting thoughts, all. I was going to try to get some more information on this tonight, however our "meeting" was called off due to my friend's torturous migraines.

Soon as I am able, I will try to glean a little bit more of the legend...er, I mean story, and keep everyone updated.:D

9DR

[m1thr0s]

this could all just be a case of monkey-see-monkey-do. if one of the members of this group happens to be a lot more persuasive than the others and had a sudden change of heart or life direction or something, the others may just be following his/her lead. that stuff happens a lot in organized worship groups on all levels...

more information will ultimately solve the riddle i think.

m1thr0s

[Nine_Days_Hung]

Well, finally got together with this small group yesterday and came to find out that the lower levels of the order are functioning business as usual. The member said that the three levels of mentors above him were discussing his progress. The top level mentor he mentioned is also #3 in that particular entire group. When we asked him, he said the top people still hadn't been heard from, but then that would only indicate 2 people who are keeping mum. Who have "disappeared."

So, it leads me to think it's some sort of test for lower members. Or perhaps the top people decided on a "haitus". Or, there is some story-telling and embellishing going on.

One good reason that illustrates why I don't care for the hierarchical structure of magickal orders. :) I've seen top people "disappear" before, and it leads to time wasted in conjecture.

Just wanted to let you know....

All the best,

9DH

[Ci Celli Ddu]

I'd have to echo previous comments to the effect that, it is virtually impossible to find any group or society of any nature where members and indeed key members do not drop off the radar. Things happen, people move on or change direction etc etc.

[Frater Yechidah]

Let's not forget that with certain "high level" magick and spiritual practices, there are many risks to one's psyche and health. Involved workings with Enochian, for one, wreak havoc on the physical body, often leaving the magician incapacitated for weeks or months. Since such workings (such as Abyss crossings) are more likely to be undertaken at a high level, it's understandable to see a consistency of absence of higher-level members in esoteric groups. Indeed, some Orders have an unannounced "time of leave" as an expectation for certain high grades/workings (like the Abyss one previously mentioned).

LLLSHJ,
Y.

[MythMath]

Recovery... :yes:

[Beros]

To make a long story short, several mid-level members are said to have simply dropped off years worth of work with their proteges, or students, or whatever the correct term might be, and simply say..."I'm done." Alledgedly, the top twelve or thirteen members of this particular order are said to have disappeared and nobody has heard anything of them.

It is always a bad idea to commit to mental arts, without regard for the legion of other egos that are present--chemically--in our brains.

A person may go 20 seconds or 20 years without such consideration. This is a perfect illustration of a shift from one combination of egos to another. It is classic and we all have seen this of ourselves and others around us. There is nothing big coming. The event is no vanguard of some ominous thing...unless you are the last member of that order--then naturally, the end is near.:laugh:

I must also entertain the thought that perhaps some of the people suddenly realized some overt silliness involved in their own craft. THAT is what makes people disappear from these orders: Vanity.