The Mûš-ruššû

[Naomi]

This is the creature on the walls at the Ishtar gate, one of the seven gates of Babylon. They are visible at the top of this forum, and in Berlin and Detroit, who have both acquired remains of the original gate. I'm trying to figure out how the Mushushu became affiliated with Ng.

Wikipedia I noticed has an excellent article on the creature here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sirrush

I think it's interesting that this was consider by the initial archaeologist who discovered the gate to be, possibly a real creature. The argument is the design remains consistent over the course of many generations, whereas mythological creatures change drastically. He also pointed out that the other animals on the gate were based on real creatures, the bull and the lion.

On a personal note, when I woke up the Ningishzidda archetype I also awakened a lion-god (who arrayed itself as Mithras) and a bull-god, as Nergal. However, Nergal had a strict scorpion-like nature to him (in my visions), and Mithras was not really associated with Lions so much as with tacky hats and daggers.

Nergal, who is an Assyrian god primarily, and an enemy of Babylon, the city of Marduk in the later dynasties, was depicted as a bull with wings and a human head (CREEPY). I have heard vague rumors that Ningishzidda was depicted as a snake with a human head but I have found no hard evidence of this. There ARE Chinese depictions of Nukua as such, though...

If you are going to do something drastic like become a xst, then please try not to impress your inevitable followers with what you are wearing, otherwise well, you just look dumb for the rest of eternity. I don't care what planet you're from, this hat will never be in style:



http://www.dazimua.com/images/occult/mithras.jpg

it looks like he's wearing one of Ningishzidda's condoms on his head.

anyways...

[m1thr0s]

The argument is the design remains consistent over the course of many generations, whereas mythological creatures change drastically.sorry, but that argument is rubbish...there are many mythological creatures that have remained constant over great periods of time...their constance is generally a testimony to their overall importance but since artists can't resist taking some amount of creative license, even great archetypes may vary a little...

take that goofy smurf hat for instance...I fear that sculptor may have died a horrible death...lol...

m1

[Naomi]

I don't know, Mithras is kind of cheesy himself you know...no offense or anything, I know it's your namesake...er....screennamesake....but I wouldn't put it past him to be a little playful. It's a hard archetype to deal with, and that's reflected in the Mithraic rites themselves. Originally he wasn't a soldier's god you see, but the discipline required to hold oneself to the standard of what Mithras was bringing to the table - divine ascenscion - made it appealing and viable for only those with a soldier's determination.

Yet this cap is actually the garb of ancient Persia - you don't see the Romans wearing it, I think the origins may have been Persia. The hat is referred to by the name "Phrygian cap". In general I think I've learned that just because a deity is harsh, does not mean they arn't also funny on purpose...

But look I just noticed something...the rear horn on the mushushu curves back and then forward just like the silly little smurf hat...Mithra, the root of Mithras came from northern Iran and means "contract" so these two archetypes would have been in close proximity to each other.

The Mushushu dragon may be the world's oldest unicorn, how about that....I'm not sure but that's what it looks like to me...

[m1thr0s]

well if nothing else it clearly suggests a peasant class roots which is important in the case of Mithrais...It's interesting that we find Ningishzida referred to as *shepherd* in various places as well...strong gods born of a strong working class people...

Mithrais didn't even become a god until much later on in his career...he was very much a classical *hero* that came from relative obscurity to ultimately surpass the gods in attainment...

m1

[MythMath]

I have heard vague rumors that Ningishzidda was depicted as a snake with a human head but I have found no hard evidence of this.
There ARE Chinese depictions of Nukua as such, though...
http://www.chinaculture.org/img/2003-09/24/kg090_01.jpg

Note the 11 smaller spheres orbiting larger
(upper & lower; sun/moon?) spheres...

Various constellations, including the 'Northern Ladle'...

The way these are depicted here,
it is reminiscent of the Lo Shu:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/fe/Luo4shu1.jpg

______________

And, oh, there's the Tetractys...!



from: republicanchina.org/prehistory.htm (http://republicanchina.org/prehistory.htm)

[m1thr0s]

yeah...what's with the tetractys just under fu hsi's arm?

m1

[MythMath]

Yeah, that's the one... :yes:

[Naomi]

Ok but what does that have to do with Ningishzidda being a Mushushu dragon? How do you know which on is Fu Hsi?

Anyways, if you add up the stars above each of their heads, it comes out to eleven.

The Tien'Kou, or "Heavenly Dog" was a comet that was a portent of death. So you see that comet there under "Nu Kua"? there's 13 stars around it...the number of death - but only in Europe. 4 is considered the number of death in both China AND Japan, but only in China is it really feared superstitiously.

The tengu may have inherited their name via China from the Tien'Kou.

"But the Chinese had a secret, and a well-guarded one at that. Associated with those seven stars, or Rishis, were other groups of seven stars, some of which helped in distributing the seven Light Streams or Rays and another which "stood behind" them (the seven Rishis and the other groups of seven) and even directed them. I will not delineate them here. We should be very clear that, even though we are talking about vast interstellar systems and Beings of fantastic Light and Magnitude, the systems at which we are looking here are only as specks of dust in the even greater vastness of our own Milky Way galaxy (http://www.astrologycom.com/imperastrol1.html#).


"Of the Northern Ladle, the Chinese said that those seven stars ".....represent the Emperor's carriage [the vehicle of God's Will], rotating around the center of the universe. It governs the 4 Directions, and divides Yin from Yang. It determines the 4 Seasons, balances the 5 Elements, regulates the divisions of time, the degrees of the sky, and many other things. Such are the stars of the Northern Ladle."

Malvin Artley, Esoteric Astrology in the Light of Ancient Chinese Knowledge
http://www.astrologycom.com/imperastrol1.html

So what's up with Ningishzidda and "I harness the twelve stars and offer you seven more?"

Anyways unicorns...I'll get back to this in a bit I suppose. I have a headache atm...I blame Ningishzidda.

[MythMath]

Sorry for the hi-jack, but I was just
comparing this more familiar image:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/d0/Nuwa%26fuxi.jpg

So compositionally similar,
so numerically different...
______________________________

Gosh, I found one more,
maybe I should split this off...?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/74/Nuva_fuxi.gif

A cross between the other two...

PseudoTetractys, here...

Only ten orbiting spheres...
______________

Are these two different 'sloppy' copies of the original...?

[Naomi]

This may all be connected so I'm not bothered by the detour, I'm trying to track down the original.

the Chinese were infamous for playing an information war with mystery revelations though, they would deliberately release misinformation to throw off people - a necessity of the time invalid today I suppose.

edit:

Notice how Nu Kua's hair (in the first and arguably more authentic looking one) is shaped like Mithras's phrygian cap?

Crown lotus, very important to the sensitive ancients, not so much today where every headache is "just a headache"....everything has meaning, if you look at it a certain way, everything....once you start looking at it that way you can steer your entire course of existence.

I know where my headache is from today, I was using a mala to repeat Ningishzidda's name...over and over. You use the mala as a reminder to say the name if you are leaving off a task (such as talking to a person where you can't use the mantra) anyways I need to lie down and go into samadhi to assimilate this download instead of playing on here.

If you're going to spend years carving a statue THAT big, or make a gate that magnificient, you're going to really sit down and think about the symbology, so artistic license wasn't quite as free back then as it is now...I can use a million colors in a few minutes if I want to, on my computer - the ancients had to sit there for a few days foraging for ingredients and grinding them into paste just to get the color GREEN for instance...

[Naomi]

Can we move this to Comparitive?

Here's one of the very earliest representations of the unicorn, I don't know what rock or area of Mesopotamia it is from, or when. I believe the Mushushu is not recognized by the world yet as being a unicorn...it's easier to notice how dragonish it is. The unicorn is an incredibly powerful symbol all over the world and if we can forge a connection with Ng that would be, well...

well it would take us deeper down the rabbithole so we can make more mashed potato sculptures....

Look at how Gilgamesh is stabbing the unicorn just like Mithras is killing the bull.

You know who else is famous for killing bulls? Durga...

[m1thr0s]

Can we move this to Comparitive?

sure.

m1

[Naomi]

Oh I see, 11 + the sun in the middle makes 12....

thanks m1thr0s