Weaving/Energy Manipulation

[fr.novumorganum]

At my current point of development, it seems the underlying 'purpose' of most ritual, when one has really achieved sucess with it, is when one has reached the point of being able to direct, control, and circulate the energy raised or created during the ritual. (other effects, of say a LBRP, seem to be a result of unconscious effects of the energy, while mastery comes from consciously directing/controlling the effects)

This could take several forms (included so readers know what I'm talking about): circulation after a MP, speading out or sealing after the LBRP or KC, infusing with LVX or planetary energy after a hex ritual, transforming the flaming sword/path into various symbols to fuse onto the tree, even creating a centripidal locus for 'manifestation' during an evocation.

My question/point is this: After reading about active skrying/weaving on these pages, I'm wondering if 'weaving' is a similar, yet more refined application of these skills, or is it a different class of operations all together?

[Kain]

At my current point of development, it seems the underlying 'purpose' of most ritual, when one has really achieved sucess with it, is when one has reached the point of being able to direct, control, and circulate the energy raised or created during the ritual. (other effects, of say a LBRP, seem to be a result of unconscious effects of the energy, while mastery comes from consciously directing/controlling the effects)My feelings on the subject of ritual are exactly the same as yours fr.novumorganum. Nowdays, my practices involve no ritual whatsoever, but are entirely composed of meticulous and almost "scientific" weaving and energy manipulation.
My question/point is this: After reading about active skrying/weaving on these pages, I'm wondering if 'weaving' is a similar, yet more refined application of these skills, or is it a different class of operations all together?Personally, I think it is the former, i.e. a very refined set of applications set around the purpose of manipulating and directing energy. The difference lies in the "scientific background" the weaver opperates through, as energy can be generally manipulated and directed through various ways and methods, but the weaver is not concerned just with the accumulation and direction, but with the very principles at work and pertaining to this direction. I think it is essentially alchemical in nature, a practice heavily concerned with the properties, characteristics and basic states through which energy works, moves and interracts. Through consciously manipulating these principles, the weaver can optimize his/her results, and produce energy fields/constructs that are a lot more efficient, both due to potency and due to constitution.

Another important point to note is that in weaving, an actual model/focal point is mostly used, in comparison to the "black mirror" used in methods of scrying. The model functions as the backbone of the process, ley-lines appropriately directed to run through it and in general the whole process revolves around it.

I think however that what really sets it apart from conventional energy manipulation is it's very technical nature.

Kain

[m1thr0s]

I reached a point somewhere, many years ago I guess, where I just got tired of defining myself as a ceremonial magician. I never really was that anyway...and yet...there is a certain "ritual" aspect to the way I go about energy working. The "cosmic dance" is all right there...the interplay between imagination and reality...between the subconscious and the superconscious...it's all there really...but what the hell to call it.

For a time I had settled on the term "ritual alchemy" and even now I feel like this is an accurate term for the particular song and dance I am especially predisposed to. If I had to pinpoint a difference it would probably be corresponding to the kinds of "archetypes" I employ...things I used to think of as "symbols" or "charts" and "graphs", I have come to view as powerful magickal alliances, mirrors, lenses, intelligences of a higher order than anthropomorphic projections can typically afford. There is no "Holy Guardian Angel" where I am...yet the TwinStar is there and I know it/him/her in intimate ways entirely transcending the idea of symbolism per se...

I am not certain of anything really as regarding traditional magicks. A careful study of Crowley at least should lead one to the natural conclusion that this man's whole life was committed to turning people onto themselves at the highest possible levels...with or without the sanction of any so-called "authority", yet always with the deepest reverence for the hard fought labors of others...a tricky balance really between respect and disrespect...between allegiance to the past and allegiance to the now.

In many ways it's all about the same thing...yet different. It's hard to say exactly what those differences are in all instances. Hadit speaks of the "Hermits" and does so in such a way as to distinguish them from...what..."thelemites" I guess...perhaps even the heirophants in a more generalized sort of way. For me, this distinction has played a defining part in the way my own path has evolved. I feel as though I really understand the "Hermits" right down to the core of my being in ways too complex to even define exactly. I feel as though I am working for them really...that my whole business in this world is locked into their business with this world even from the beginning of time itself... Is this not a magickal projection of its own kind?

Whatever we do, however we do it...we need mainly to include all possibilities insofar as we might be able. We never really know where the next bend in the road will take us, so it behooves us to be open at all times to all points compass, insofar as we are humanly capable...and maybe even more than this.

But I no longer feel any compunction to do anything proscribed by others. I think my own path has become sufficiently advanced over time that it is now calling the shots of its own accord and it is these things above all else that I must attend to each and every day.

Weaving work itself is essentially tantric in scope and nature. We seek to affect change upon ourselves in as direct a way as possible in lieu of every other self to the best of our abilities. So the focus is a little different and, to be honest, the requirement of "belief" is somewhat lessened as well. If I had to make just one distinction it would be between Tantric Work vs Ceremonial, where the focus tends to extend to the outer circle, where the Tantric rarely goes directly.

m1thr0s

[motsie]

I'm curious about something. I was noting your reference to Twinstar and the fact that you implied that this entity/balance in correlated to the HGA in terms of functionality. Please forgive my imprecise language, I am new to this field and I wasn't too attentive in my own either.

I have an aquaintance who for many reasons, such as his place and time of ultimate origin. his original purpose, and a binding oath accident that structures his incarnational strategy, believes that he does not have a HGA to assist in his crossing the abyss. While I accept that his premise may be accurate, it does not feel as if he is incorporating the entire picture and I think he is looking into a personal blind spot.

I would appreciate it if you would provide elucidation upon the nature of the Twinstar and it's position in the macrocosm.

Humbly yours,

motsie

[m1thr0s]

Perhaps it is simply the language of the HGA that has put him off...I wouldn't really know. In my case I have essentially replaced the principle of the HGA with the principle of Logos as originally defined in the Greek, which allows for the possibility of any manifest principle of Perfection to act directly as guide and counselor to the attainment of that goal. This has diverse kinds of applications and filters down to any kind of "heuristic" really, relative to any task in advance of ones immediate understanding. So any "model" of reality can act as guide and counselor to the manifestation of that reality. The language of the HGA is just one variation on a fairly universal theme. Not everybody is well suited to that particular language.

m1thr0s

[fr.novumorganum]

Thank you Kain and M1thr0s for your cogent answers. From a different tact, you both provided needed answers.

While I have a general intuition about where my path lies, I guess its the technical aspects of these applications I need to bone up on most.

[Amur]

An interesting thing about when having the spine-circuit online and kicking. I was perfectly established conduit between Earth and Heaven inside my own body. When I thought about 'reiki' or some other 'energy' I almost laughed my head off as it was absurd and non-existent. The energy-manipulation in that state was direct and didn't need anykind of symbolic behavior. Anything could be done directly. Unfortunately I fell down from the state into insanity again shortly afterwards from a mistake of depleting the sexual energy. Was funny to notice the falling from a perfectly clear state into an insanity which most more or less seem to be living in (me even more so ;) )

[m1thr0s]

I think Kain's point about the technical aspect of things is very well taken, It's just a little hard to qualify since certainly all magickal work has its technical side. But these days I am more inclined to think of myself as an actual technician than a magician, a physician, an engineer, even a mechanic or a metaprogrammer...this whole sense of being involved at the nuts-and-bolts level of the Body of Light and its actual technology is very strong with me. I am not entirely sure if this is just the result of the kind of systems I am attracted to or if it is a difference of path itself, but I suspect the latter somehow...

Why don't alchemists define themselves as magicians? Surely they have many things in common, yet it seems that alchemists are generally more keen on the mechanics of things which is a motivating factor in itself and enough to pique their interest even above and beyond any other more philosophical considerations... We're all pushing the same "stuff" around basically, very often operating on the same kinds of assumptions, using much of the same language and so on...yet some of us are more inclined to perceive ourselves as dealing more in technicianship than magicianship...

So I am very much in agreement with that. I don't necessarily understand it, don't understand why this appeals to some and not to others etc, but it certainly is a factor in how things play out at the level of self-identification...

m1thr0s

[Kain]

Very glad to be of help fr.novumorganum!

I think Kain's point about the technical aspect of things is very well taken, It's just a little hard to qualify since certainly all magickal work has its technical side. But these days I am more inclined to think of myself as an actual technician than a magician, a physician, an engineer, even a mechanic or a metaprogrammer...this whole sense of being involved at the nuts-and-bolts level of the Body of Light and its actual technology is very strong with me. I am not entirely sure if this is just the result of the kind of systems I am attracted to or if it is a difference of path itself, but I suspect the latter somehow...This particular definition of technician rings very true and very strongly with me too so I understand this perfectly, and approach it in the same way.

Kain

[m1thr0s]

One of the interesting things I have noted is what a desperate lack of information exists on weaving itself. It baffles me, since it is a key element in virtually all formal magickal practise, yet it is hardly addressed at all. We are left to fend for ourselves in an area that is highly technical and offers many possibilities for error. We are occasionally told that this word goes in this direction or that word goes with that symbol but that's about it, and the arguments offered to justify any of it are bullshit, to put it directly, if they are even offered up at all. Weaving has become its own sacred cow somehow...too important to even be discussed intelligently. I have it in for sacred cows in a big way so I am not pleased with this trend and I aim to attack it with both barrels.

As this site develops more it will gradually become more apparent that weaving is really the core discipline around which all this math and geometry stuff revolves. These are not ends in themselves but technical guidelines for achieving highly efficient results in weaving work. Just like musical scales lays down a structure to various forms of music, the binary and ternary systems discussed here lay down a structural guidelines for the creation of balanced energy fields which are accomplished as a matter of energy weaving. To the best of my knowledge, there is nothing quite like it anywhere and I have certainly looked. We find bits of it here, bits of it there, vague allusions to things we never get to see the finalized version of (shemhamphorasch for instance). All this hush-hush crap is only defeating our ultimate purpose if our purpose is to understand and master the Body of Light itself. I do not know that there is any good excuse for this and I don't like excuses anyway. I have no reason not to assume that the general lack of useful information in this area is a direct result of a general lack of understanding among even the so-called masters themselves. We are perhaps too quick to give credit where it is, in fact, not actually due. This is just another form of wishful thinking in the end and it will not make it possible for us to realize our own utmost potentials.

In my view, the magickal methodology of scrying and/or weaving is possibly the single most defining thing that magickal philosophy itself brings to the table, yet it is ultimately the least discussed and the poorest exemplified. So I have set my task to rectifying that problem with everything in my "six demon bag". Certainly no one is compelled to do as I do but at the end of the day it will be fairly evident that Mutational Alchemy is a whole-on knowledge and conversation in its own right that cuts right through the crap and goes straight to the heart of high-magick in its most fundamental form. Weaving is what it is so far as I am concerned. Weaving is the Way...

Sometimes a Great Work is best defined by a Great Lack of one kind or another. For as long as I have been studying magick and mysticism, this has always struck me as the most lacking thing of all...

m1thr0s

[Phoenix]

An interesting thing about when having the spine-circuit online and kicking. I was perfectly established conduit between Earth and Heaven inside my own body. When I thought about 'reiki' or some other 'energy' I almost laughed my head off as it was absurd and non-existent. The energy-manipulation in that state was direct and didn't need anykind of symbolic behavior. Anything could be done directly. Unfortunately I fell down from the state into insanity again shortly afterwards from a mistake of depleting the sexual energy. Was funny to notice the falling from a perfectly clear state into an insanity which most more or less seem to be living in (me even more so ;) )


If we are dicussing energy , i have a spark to add to the discution.
That spark is Ki or CHI.
Some of you might know what i am saying but few realize it there.
My contatc with martial arts made me aware of this natural form of energy, it is a form of misc between Adrenalin and spirituality.
When Chi is focused strength (of impact)is multiplied several times, the chanel is the formal exercise of the kata.
it´s not magick but it´s souce is ritualistic

yet some of us are more inclined to perceive ourselves as dealing more in technicianship than magicianship...


indeed....

But what can be called the correct practise of weaving or energy manipullation?

wich principle is the correct?

:eek:

[Kain]

Well, having personal experience with the manipulation and direction of Chi as well, I personally think that a practice as broad as Weaving actually includes the practice of Chi manipulation in a way, Chi being more specifically focused around the kind of energy pertaining to the body itself while Weaving being concerned with the technical aspects of direction and manipulation of energy in general (meaning that it aims to encompass and track the interractions of potentially much subtler fields, thus approaches energy in a different fashion). Due to this difference of focus, I think the question of "correct" practice of Weaving as opposed to Chi manipulation cannot really be raised, in the sense that they describe different processes at work. Certainly they both deal with energy, yet define their subject energy in different intensities of abstraction. Thus, I think that even though energy manipulation in general is actually very precise in it's application and technical nature (as you must know yourself Phoenix), we are dealing with different systems here.

Kain

[m1thr0s]

Know your terms before dissecting them:
See: Tantra (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tantra) and pay special attention to the opening phrase of this definition:
Tantra (Sanskrit: "weave" denoting continuity[1]), tantric yoga, or tantrism refers to a collection of esoteric philosophies and spiritual practices found in several religions of Indian origin. Tantric denominations exist in Hinduism, Bönpoism, Buddhism, and Jainism. Tantra, in its various forms, has existed in India, China, Japan, Tibet, Nepal, Bhutan, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Korea, Cambodia, Burma, Indonesia and Mongolia..."Weaving" alludes to the active application of tantric focus, or concentration disciplines, of which Chi work is one such application. It is extremely important that Tantra has evolved a number of specialized areas of focus and will hopefully continue to do so as long as there is any stone left unturned in this most ancient technology.

m1thr0s

[Phoenix]

Thanks for the info, that will clear some of the fog in my investigation

Thank you gentleman.;)

[Okazaki Castle]

My question/point is this: After reading about active skrying/weaving on these pages, I'm wondering if 'weaving' is a similar, yet more refined application of these skills, or is it a different class of operations all together?

Well, let me give you the results of my experience in this field. Back near the beginning of this year, things got too dangerous and boring for me as a conscious ego personality to find a way round them in as fast and efficient a way as I required. So I left my body, spiralling out to other realms, and leaving the directive: 'Let the most powerful and useful of existing entities who wants to use this form and can solve the predicaments I've put it in take over for a while, and run it.'

The entity who came in to run things was who I came to know as Tomagahane Son Principle. Distinctly different character and priorities to me. More fun and sociable for a start. But also knows just about everything there is to know about how systems (Creations) work and how to go about moving them, locking them, redirecting them (AIKI principle) and so on.

So what he did, using my form, was to go about doing what he refered to as one long weave. It basically involved him walking around, socializing with pretty much everybody he found interesting, and spending all my money (I had quite a large sum then, presumably provided to me by the life process for precisely this purpose).

His logic was as follows:

This reality is a physical reality. Everything that happens here is true, because it is physically existing. All physically existing realities within a Time system move forward within that Time system - unless they are destroyed and rendered null and void in some way. To make a reality strong you need to bind it to physicality in strong ways.

The way to bind things to physicality in strong ways is to literally weave it. This involves putting it into the combined non-physical structures and forms which support, sustain and change physicality. For example, whilst nerves and brains are physical, understanding is a causal phenomenon and property. So too is emotion. So too is judegement. Yet all these things have corresponding physical binds, or structures, which allow for their 'interface' with the physical. For example, the nerval structures which we think thru.

Thus what weaving ammounts to is living a reality in practice in this physical world. And getting as large a web as possible to live it with you. The largeness of the web, and the intensity with which you interact with it, is what will give your weave force, power.

The problem as to getting people to live your reality/weave. Simply don't tell them the full picture and spend lots of money, giving them goods and tips and creating the image of wealth. This is in practice what most people focus on most, and so what they believe, what attracts them, what they want to be a part of. Hence, they draw to it, opening the gates into their subconscious for you themselves. Then, that image you put there, is moved forward by their desire structures into manifestation.

Simultaneously as your doing this, the vibration of your chakras, aura and so on emanates out into physicality. Thereby these emmanations do in turn vibrate stones, trees, even the outer reaches of the solar system. These are emmanations and vibrations which even under ordinary circumstances do not ever die out completely (at least until the dissolution of a physical reality or Creation). The key there is to make them accelerate as fast as possible, for that way they gather mass and power unto themselves as time progresses, rather than diminishing in power as time progresses which is the normal movement of things in a time system. In other words, the reality you are weaving has to be moved forward at a grater rate of acceleration than the reality, or context, which you are contesting, or seeking to change, with your weave.

Anyway, the other way I found was useful to get people / organizations to live/contribute to your weave was to threaten people with death: then they focus on you very intensely to see if there's some way they can neutralize this threat to their existence, within the situation of the predicament in which they find themselves. This helps if it's a tangible threat which does not go away and which they cannot escape from.

You have to believe in the weave yourself, and live it as real. That's why it was useful for me to get Tomagahane Son Principle to do it, because whilst he knew much about my scenarios and tools - and was clear as to what I wanted done - simply fitting his character into my physical form meant he had to undergo various other limitations of his being, and also forget much of what he himself knew prior to entering. thus, he could live as real the reality which he received from his own higher aspects: precisely because he didn't know entirely where he stood or how this world was set up. Plus, it must be said, he didn't really care what it's established Status Quo was, he always viewed himself as God in some way and knew he couldn't be touched, not really, and so just went around insulting the powers-that-be, to their face, walking a fine line only to the extent that enabled him to avoid time-consuming hassles so that he could spend more time spending my money and socializing with people, women and whores. I kinda liked that time period myself, cuz that character is a fun one to live, less responsible and constrained and dark than my Sebastian character...

So the important factors there seem to be then:

1. Just do it! Live it...
2. Keep it real. It has to be real to work, which means you have to believe, you have to have the real desires you portray, you have to have the real ideas you express and so on.

That's it really. Then just keep on doing it, to the level of your competence, until you have to stop or have attained what you aimed for. In my case that was introducing a New Creation here to this planet and physical universe, and withdrawing the Old Creation from it. Basically change the rule book on everybody. Did that, and then beyond that also informed the illuminati of who we were, and thier having been targetted, and their therefore imminent coming demise (went round embassies in London, UK handing them ultimatums + information packs). Yet, because they were not properly interacting with a being who was incarnated here or limited to their stupid systems, but with one aspect of the Lord of All Creations, the karmic/energetic connections weren't there for them to behave as they normally would in such circumstances, and instead were left stunned and watching, seeing what would be done next (so that they could understand precisely what they were dealing with, from their persepctive for example). Which is precisely what Tomagahane Son Principle wanted them to think and feel, and told them to think and feel. And they did. He just didn't tell them that's how it worked at the time, and let them underestimate him cuz he spent most of his time wandering around being enthusiastic at being on Earth, smoking ganga and fucking whores. Well, you've got to give them a package they find attractive enough to bother with you, plus checkmate them in some way to get such entities to do things like this for you in practice.

So that's how you weave. Got it on the highest authority (or close to) and it does seem to work and does make sense, logically speaking. How to make the Secret (or magickal) Life real.

Other perspectives, more information and comments are invited...

Best Regards,
Oazaki.

[m1thr0s]

Thus what weaving ammounts to is living a reality in practice in this physical world. And getting as large a web as possible to live it with you. The largeness of the web, and the intensity with which you interact with it, is what will give your weave force, power.That's very cool Oazaki...right on the money.

One of the things to bear in mind even with the more technical aspects of specific kinds of tantric weaving practises is that what you are actually doing is training the autonomic nervous system itself to perform these operations...ultimately...on auto-pilot. So success can be measured by the degree to which you are able to achieve this omnipresent "hum" action. One of the reasons "right thinking" is so important is simply that "wrong thinking" cannot be maintained as frictionlessly as "right thinking" can. When a thing is "right", it is right on all important levels and therefor the body itself can assume the operations after a certain amount of training in. "Wrong thinking" is a maintenance whore that never does achieve this same kind of efficiency.

m1thr0s

[Kain]

I agree as well, very nice way of putting it Okazaki.
One of the reasons "right thinking" is so important is simply that "wrong thinking" cannot be maintained as frictionlessly as "right thinking" can. When a thing is "right", it is right on all important levels and therefor the body itself can assume the operations after a certain amount of training in. "Wrong thinking" is a maintenance whore that never does achieve this same kind of efficiency. So true...

Kain

[Okazaki Castle]

One of the things to bear in mind even with the more technical aspects of specific kinds of tantric weaving practises is that what you are actually doing is training the autonomic nervous system itself to perform these operations...ultimately...on auto-pilot. So success can be measured by the degree to which you are able to achieve this omnipresent "hum" action.

Put everything on automatic you mean so that yo don't have to work at it every damn day, it just continues of its own accord and fulfilles itself as fast as the evolving processes of Creation allow? Absolutely, why did you think I delegated the whole design to Time through The Arhes bundle? It is because Time just keeps on turning, doesn't stop... and as far as I'm concerned it has responsibilities... *and* must really, really try to fulfill them well, and faster than is its normal wont, or else, as usual, I destroy it in a variety of nasty ways. :rofl: :cool:

The ongoing process of automatic fulfilment is about the only way to get everything done that needs to be done. Our job as conscious incarnated personalities is to simply ride that wave, creating gateways in our own lives and doing the minimum possible to allow for its fulfilment... Or another way of putting that: once self-conscious be lazy - aka efficiency on easy.

Thx Kain, good to hear from you :)

all the best,
Oazaki.

[silentjohn]

So I left my body, spiralling out to other realms, and leaving the directive: 'Let the most powerful and useful of existing entities who wants to use this form and can solve the predicaments I've put it in take over for a while, and run it.'


Great directive. I didn't plan that far ahead, and when I left I came right back, knowing that if I didn't my form would wind up in a mental institution - not effective at all really. So a large portion of what I've been up to is organizing and aligning all of the data I encountered .... "out there" so that It'll make sense "in here".

You'll have to excuse my abstract terminology. I don't have much time to write at this juncture.

Anyway why bother with translating it al as said? I could leave it at intuition, or maybe as I am an artist I seek to make the formaly inexpressable rather understandable - ie expressed. Rungs on a ladder sort of thing... blocks in a pyramid.

Speaking of which, getting this universal flow to cooperate with my system while I remove unstable energetics (see geometry) has been quite daunting. That's the price I pay for my childish zeal I suppose.

I'll write more later.

:D

your friend,
quiet science.

[Okazaki Castle]

Great directive. I didn't plan that far ahead, and when I left I came right back, knowing that if I didn't my form would wind up in a mental institution - not effective at all really.


Mmm, that rather underhanded ploy was always te greatest danger for the fewof us who took that route. 'tis part of the reason I had the ganga upfront there, cuz everything could always be blamed on te drugs there, given the already-present view of them in this system. Also, of course, the wilingness to fight to the death if necessary (theirs) when we ourselves can't die or lose according to the laws of Creation (zhedhi chart, etc) helped. Twas an intense weave that one though, and best avoided if at all possible.

I was always impressed by the quiet, competent way you handled things SJ, just getting on with the path and what needed to be done: achieving, integrating, then on without pause or rest, and few rewards external. Especially hard when you're doing it without a soul, as we were for a fair lng time there...


So a large portion of what I've been up to is organizing and aligning all of the data I encountered .... "out there" so that It'll make sense "in here".


I'd be interested your results/conclusions there when you feel like posting/revealing them... :cool:

Your friend,
Sebastian / Oazaki.

[silentjohn]

I'd be interested your results/conclusions there when you feel like posting/revealing them... :cool:


Right. Phase one is a releasing of that which is clutched. And an embrace of that which clutches.

[Kain]

Right. Phase one is a releasing of that which is clutched. And an embrace of that which clutches.That is so well put by the way silentjohn! :)

Kain

[fr.novumorganum]

thank you for the additions everyone; this is helping me refine my practice

[silentjohn]

That is so well put by the way silentjohn! :)

Kain

XCool.

Rhwn you xn re-grasp that which was clutched IF YOU LIKE, which is better, no?
:cool:

As mind is formed of course there is influence from "spirit" ... but also lots of goop the refined systems may or may not desire. Really - Venus kicks ass here. At least IMO. Which isn't to say I'm not humble.:rolleyes:

OK seriously folks on a sidenote shouldn't we have some smilies with a lil more m1thr0sian aura to them?

[m1thr0s]

OK seriously folks on a sidenote shouldn't we have some smilies with a lil more m1thr0sian aura to them?lol...it's hard to find smilies that are "dark" enough...

I'm still looking though...

m1thr0s

[silentjohn]

lol...it's hard to find smilies that are "dark" enough...

I'm still looking though...

m1thr0s


http://www.jms101.btinternet.co.uk/basic_sets/misc/devil/index.htm

:rofl:

[Phoenix]

LOL

that´s it

[BrotherM]

Greetings all,

A while ago I went through an initiatory episode that wasn't overly pleasant and resulted in me totally changing the way I lived magick. Ceremonial magick in the traditional sense became unfulfilling to the extreme and a large void opened up inside of me and threatened to engulf me, so I worked through it.

The crux of the outcome is this, I stopped using ritual and physical techniques to cause change by the force of will and began wielding the basic curents of the universe directly. Initially, this was very hard and I really teatered on the edge. Kind of like an evocation hangover times a million, I never knew if I was coming or going, but the results were amazing. On a spiritual side, the initiatory experience was incredible and I learnt what I feel is a lot (compared to my initial limited knowledge) about the building blocks of the universe. In a mundane sense, ok, as an example, I travelled from East London to Oxford, in a bus, on Friday Afternoon, at 5:30pm, with two accidents on the motorway ... in 45 minutes. This normally takes 2 hours in no traffic. Hey, I was late to pick up the Dawg and what is magick if you can't use it practically?

Anyway, I thought that I had trodden the Fools path for too long and had finally flipped out, but if this is similar to Weaving, and many of you guys do it as well, it would be good to learn about how and what you do? It is funny that if you walk a dark path long enough, eventually you find some light along the way.

BrotherM

[Okazaki Castle]

It is funny that if you walk a dark path long enough, eventually you find some light along the way.


When the stars threw down their spears
And water'd heaven with their tears,
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the Lamb make thee?

Tyger, Tyger, burning bright
In the forests of the night,
What immortal hand or eye
Dare frame thy fearful symmetry?

Yeah, made me laugh... :D :laugh:

all the best,
Oazaki.

[BrotherM]

Ah, ok? I'm not sure what you mean Oazaki, is what I do what people here call Weaving? or is Weaving something different and what I explained just me? No offense man, I just don't understand what you are saying bro.

BrotherM

[Naomi]

He's referring to the tiger principle/path, in which you walk the path of darkness to find the light. It is diagrammed on the taijitu.

Tyger, Tyger, burning bright
In the forests of the night,

[BrotherM]

He's referring to the tiger principle/path, in which you walk the path of darkness to find the light. It is diagrammed on the taijitu.

Tyger, Tyger, burning bright
In the forests of the night,

Thank you Naomi, ok, it was not meant to have anything to do with my actual question about this Weaving stuff, just my state in general, that's fine.

However, I am not sure it is what I meant about my state, sorry to cause confusion. I meant dark as in undefined, not dark as in spiritually bleak. I have been lead here entirely by my will to be spiritually fulfilled and not by any material or principle or set form of study. The whole reason I am here (which is good) is because I was very unfulfilled viewing the universe through the lense of somebody elses model and needed to go down to the most basic building blocks.

To randomly find a bunch of people doing something that sounds similar, now that's interesting! However, are you doing something similar?

BrotherM

[Naomi]

I'm floating retrogade through space around Saturn. Is that similar to what you are saying?

I think it is greight you have a will to break the mold and throw away other people's lenses. I always like to remember that you will not lose your way by going back to your roots. Back to basics is great. I always find it helpful to start over when a painting is not going the way I want it. Usually the next one turns out much better.

[BrotherM]

I'm floating retrogade through space around Saturn. Is that similar to what you are saying?

No, Saturn and space have form, where I am there is only flow, pure energy, the basic building blocks yet to condense. I'll stop hijacking the thread now, there is a lot of new terminology and methods here (for me anyway). Thanks for your help, I'll now do some reading.

BrotherM

[Naomi]

So that's interesting. Would you say the entire universe is not made mostly of energy?

[fr.novumorganum]

No, Saturn and space have form, where I am there is only flow, pure energy, the basic building blocks yet to condense. I'll stop hijacking the thread now, there is a lot of new terminology and methods here (for me anyway). Thanks for your help, I'll now do some reading.

BrotherM

it sounds to me like you have really tapped into a current, BrotherM. People talk about them all the time, but when you really tap into one....

[Naomi]

Yes it sounds like he is talking about The Source. I mostly find that planets and miscellaneous things emerge from the dark matter because it's attracted to the light. Butterflies or moths....

[BrotherM]

So that's interesting. Would you say the entire universe is not made mostly of energy?

Yes, entirely, however, by your description, it has already formed Saturn and Space About Saturn when you interact with it. The same applies to spirits, we summon, they form, we interact.

When I used models and cermonial techniques it was almost like I was interacting with a moment in time of a specific current, like for me to interact, the energy had to form into something I could relate to on a semi or fully concious level. The techniques and rituals where a way to almost take a cross section of the current and bring it down to our plain. When I say, "Going back to basics", I mean interaction with the universe on a more basic level, one that does not require concious understanding or form. Instead of dealing with Architypes, colours, correspondences and models like the ToL or whatever, I am learning to deal with flow, just pure flow. It is what exists between oblivion and the Architypes.

I know I am not making sense, kind of why I was posting in the first place.

it sounds to me like you have really tapped into a current, BrotherM. People talk about them all the time, but when you really tap into one....

It's a bit of a learning curve :confused: , does my head in. At least the old way I could philosophise about it, now ... it just does my head in. Hense the excitement at the whole Weaving thing. Anyway, sorry for taking the thread OT.

BrotherM

[fr.novumorganum]

ideas are to concepts as constellations are to stars...

[fr.novumorganum]

I'll start a thread for discussions of currents/the source.

[Okazaki Castle]

When the stars threw down their spears
And water'd heaven with their tears,
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the Lamb make thee?

Tyger, Tyger, burning bright
In the forests of the night,
What immortal hand or eye
Dare frame thy fearful symmetry?

Yeah, this is basically how you transcend Time. You go and sit in Original Void, above the Lords of Planes and just below source level usually, and look out at the Realms of Light and Matter. Then you say to the planets of the system and the lessons they embody: "Piss off, I'm not learning your crap anymore. You do what I want henceforth, you are my tools and I am your master." That's why the 'stars throw down their spears'. To get to that level of consciousness you have to use geometry: can't be done just with meditation alone, even if you know where you're going. Hence the immortal hand and eye, who are framing symmetries.

This in turn allows you to get the planets and stars (and other manifestations of Time) to do your weaving for you. They use a rather large canvas, but it permeates everything on Earth, and doesn't stop, so is quite useful as an 'engine', or power source. Perpetual motion machine already in place if you like, biggest one there is too...

In 'light weaving' you combine the occurring elements, energies and scenarios of the moment to create your occurring reality. In dark weaving you determine those factors which produce the context of factors that are weaved with in ligh weaving. Hence, Dark Weaving can be used to change the factor base (or elemental base) you have to work with in Light Weaving. This is especially useful if some factors in the Realms of Light are otherwise than you would want them, and you want to edit. For example, personally I applied the process of 'edit on dark' to the planet neptune's nature which was too involved and reflective of abusive western medicine. Also, I am in the process of cutting the years 2002 and 2005 from the historical record and timeline of this planet and solar system. That's the sort of stuff you do on dark weaving: large scale and very fucking hardcore. Why so hardcore? Well, others are there also, and its own nature is not gentle. You do not gain access to things like this without fighting for it, and earning it, and being worthy of it. Enter these gates and you attract people's attention, then they pay attention to you, and decide. So, impressed you've been there and are working with this sort of stuff BrotherM!

What's your connection to New Orleans btw, or am I misinterpreting what I pick up there?

all the best,
Oazaki.

[BrotherM]

Oazaki,

You are on a different level to me, but thank you for coming down to mine to explain. You have explained very accurately what I am experiencing, I hadn't even began to understand the 'dark' and 'light', but now that you explain it, it clicks, thank you.

You are right, it is hardcore, disruptive and very rough. The first few times I grabbed hold of the currents and started working it hurt, a lot! It still does man, but the more I work the better it gets. It is an interesting pain, not bad, just like I am being stretched to the very core. I am in such a deep state, it is hard to describe.

Many thanks,

BrotherM

[Okazaki Castle]

Nah man, just went there first. Anyobody who gets into that space is automatically 'First amopng Equals' in a way, it's why we all get along. Check out the Tengu, most of them are there waving at people, and they're good for helping with the ropes, like introductory lessons or assistance if you like...

Glad to be of help btw :) It is also good to see someone else accessing this stuff and talking about it publicly. Most of the ones who do this level are very tight-lipped about it.

As for the cuts, easiest way to reduce those is to run it thru all at once into some physical binds. Blood seals are useful for that, if you use a knife to draw the blood. Careful with that though, don't want to leave scars and stuff... Only do if it draws you of its own accord, also. Maybe another form of bind or draw for the harshness of that level (gotta get cut to get there, and to use it) is better for you. So feel and decide for yourself on that one sort of thing.

Let me know how it goes.

all the best,
Oazaki.

[Ci Celli Ddu]

My feelings on the subject of ritual are exactly the same as yours fr.novumorganum. Nowdays, my practices involve no ritual whatsoever, but are entirely composed of meticulous and almost "scientific" weaving and energy manipulation.


Apart from the most basic and stripped down form of intuitive ritual, Ive never gone into ceremonial stuff myself. My manipulation of energy has pretty much always been performed through a mixture of improvisation and basic sympathetic magic, singing, touch, pure thought, and in recent years Ive picked up a penchant for using katas. As I mentioned on another thread, I like "Lo-tech and hidden in plain sight" (to quote MythMath). Maybe it's my Slavic side coming through. I looked up Slavic Magic a few years back and found it pretty much emulated what I'd been doing instinctively. I love Lo-tech. :D

[Naomi]

Apart from the most basic and stripped down form of intuitive ritual, Ive never gone into ceremonial stuff myself. My manipulation of energy has pretty much always been performed through a mixture of improvisation and basic sympathetic magic, singing, touch, pure thought, and in recent years Ive picked up a penchant for using katas. As I mentioned on another thread, I like "Lo-tech and hidden in plain sight" (to quote MythMath). Maybe it's my Slavic side coming through. I looked up Slavic Magic a few years back and found it pretty much emulated what I'd been doing instinctively. I love Lo-tech. :D

Oh no shit! Do you know the San Shin No Kata?

They invoke or evoke the elements. I would like to find out the experiences of others who have worked with them.

Here is a story about the San Shin No Kata as it is told to a big tree:

Excerpt:

"This teaching is based on a saying that the spirit of a three year old is with a man until he is a hundred years old."

"(it) teaches beginners that we have to train ourselves with the spirit of a three year old, not forgetting the spirit even though they think they accomplish these techniques."

http://home.no.net/sanshin/dokumenter/sanshin.pdf (http://home.no.net/sanshin/dokumenter/sanshin.pdf)

And what you say about lo-tech is great. Getting low can get you so many places! It is why I advocate the use of herbs, stones and other witch tricks. More time for me, less time managing! And like Wolverine from the X-men, sometimes it just works better. I like no-fuss no-muss. The ceremonial stuff was very playful and colorful, and there is a sense of solemnity to the proceedings. I always felt very serious. You can see that coming through in my journals and for part of the way in my postings on the unmentionable forums of days goneby.

So Okazaki that is why I made all of those blood paintings I guess when I was young. I showed them to a teacher at school! She told me "I can feel the energy coming from these." One was a scorpion but I cannot remember what the other two are. But that's an "ahah!" moment for me...why I did that and especially the image of the scorpion (Associated with the lord of hell and some other important things) That was maybe 12 years ago but I also remember all of the really strange rituals I did. You know it was just like Tamagahane! LOL!

[Ci Celli Ddu]

Oh no shit! Do you know the San Shin No Kata?
No, just Shotokan Katas (http://www.natkd.com/shotokan_katas.htm)

[Kuroyagi]

shotokan...kara-te. :laugh:

once a friend of mine defeated 5 turkish youths with his karate-"he was sooo brave"! hahaha! he was the national youth campignon then...natsukashii...

shouryuuken!

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g243/acr01/ShinShouryuuken.gif


20

Agreement and angry rejection;
How great is the difference between them?
Beautiful and ugly;
What's it like—the difference between them?
The one who is feared by others,
Must also because of this fear other men.
Wild, unrestrained! It will never come to an end!

The multitudes are peaceful and happy;
Like climbing a terrace in springtime to feast at the tai-lao sacrifice.
But I'm tranquil and quiet—not yet having given any sign.
Like a child who has not yet smiled.
Tired and exhausted—as though I have no place to return.
The multitudes all have a surplus.
[I alone seem to be lacking.]
Mine is the mind of a fool—ignorant and stupid!
The common people see things clearly;
I alone am in the dark.
The common people discriminate and make fine distinctions;
I alone am muddled and confused.
Formless am I! Like the ocean;
Shapeless am I! As though I have nothing in which I can rest.
The masses all have their reasons [for acting];
I alone am stupid and obstinate like a rustic.
But my desires alone differ from those of others—
For I value drawing sustenance from the Mother.



shouryuuken- hadouken-tatsumakisenpuukyaku...hahaha!-research them all -DILIGENTLY!

[Ci Celli Ddu]

he was the national youth campignon then

A mushroom? :p

[Kuroyagi]

"Well spotted, you ol bard!"!!! :laugh:

[Naomi]

WELL WOWIEE I guess he is feeling like his old self again.

Was that a sex joke?

I'm not sure.

That's a good question, however. What is the secret of Hadouken? Did you ever see that video recording of the Tibetan monk igniting a paper ball? Perhaps you can fake it with linseed oil but....I wonder.

I read of that Donahue fellow that he made the water main in his neighborhood explode by sucking all of the fire element out of his surroundings and into his magic wand.