View Full Version : Egregore defense
Well.. Looking at how the groups clump together into egregores, with their own connection to the individual. It is almost crucial for the magickian to be able to be immune to the corresponding egregore affecting. From my own experience in this dream, they've made up a system whereas the egregore affects through the non-existent chakra of the crown. It's quite straightforward to keep 1 to 6 billion people in an egregore, though the more people, the more details and naturality it needs to not make them squareheads.
Which brings us to the point of religions and other weird power-draining cults. Looking at how many start to behave in a similar fashion who are connected to the whole thing, it's crucial to be able to defend. Got any good techniques handy?
From the non-existent crown, it is quite easy to manage the other non-existent chakras in the body *grin*. And through that it's quite delicate to conjure up a formula to control the thoughts and emotions of someone. One way of defense came up, which was to root the crown into Void itself. That way there is no possible way that any egregore would come or even see oneself.
One way of defense came up, which was to root the crown into Void itself. That way there is no possible way that any egregore would come or even see oneself.You know, this is somethnig I am practicing myself, and in my experience it's even essential to consciously include the negative veils in order for the system to function properly.
Kain
Another would be to create a self-subsisting unit to work from. Whereas everything impacting on that self-subsisting unit wouldn't give anything to the whole unit unless it needed it itself. This way one could add up neutralized pieces to it whenever needed. Which in turn would render all egregores into a neutral ground as one would be completely immune to them.
Logically this is quite easy to come up with. Emotionally I'm not sure yet how it is done, or I do have a clue. But it will trigger somekind of revolution when it happens, as people won't take shit anymore from other. Naturally children are in this state already when they come but then they think that they need to move out from it and join the 'adults' lol.
The emotional system could perhaps use samekind of systems that is already in the body to govern it's own needs. Like hunger for something when it is hungry for, and why not thrist also. Naturally the intaken energy would become neutralized and converted into ones own energy, instead of using the energy as a meme from somewhere else. Everything would be converted to self and then from there project outwards. No external things would exist in the internal.
Got any ideas?
Here's a concept which just came up. It evolves around ones own Star formation, projecting it outwards through a triangle formulation. It should be enough to get even the smallest ones to get their voice heard. Each cycle would naturally be of a higher frequency with a higher pitch of energy in itself. When the Higher Genius is embodied into this physical I believe one has come quite far.
Blue Formation (http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/3295/ascensionblueformationll1.jpg)
Blue (http://show.imagehosting.us/show/1611849/0/nouser_1611/T0_-1_1611849.jpg)
Red (http://show.imagehosting.us/show/1611853/0/nouser_1611/T0_-1_1611853.jpg)
Purple (http://show.imagehosting.us/show/1611852/0/nouser_1611/T0_-1_1611852.jpg)
Dunno why but along with the recent dreams things are going to be quite terrible. Omnipotency in this physical dimension can be quite scary.
Nice graphic Amur. That's how it works really, from my viewpoint anyway. The problem, I think, lies in the reconfiguration and conscious acknowledgement and realization of the said formation on a higher state/cycle. The process of transcending the midpoint between two apex(es?), from the previous configuration having outlived it's usefulness to the higher and aspiring one, is where the real pain lies...which of course can vary in duration and intensity, is highly dependant on the practitioner and his/her current state of evolution, but still remains one of the most formidable opponents to tackle in such a work...the Dark Night of the Soul, as is often mentioned as...
The emotional system could perhaps use samekind of systems that is already in the body to govern it's own needs. Like hunger for something when it is hungry for, and why not thrist also. Naturally the intaken energy would become neutralized and converted into ones own energy, instead of using the energy as a meme from somewhere else. Everything would be converted to self and then from there project outwards. No external things would exist in the internal.
Got any ideas?That's an interesting approach, and one that I have entertained and mentally expanded on for a long while. What I have observed is that, although being fully punctual in theory, it seems to come against some quite important practical obstacles. The thing is, that is exactly the way one would go about integrating things, however what is often not initially realized is that it seems we can neutralize and convert only the constructs that can be compared to our current conscious configuration. This means that we are actually standing on constructs whose structure and influence is often larger, more complex and more powerful than what our system can directly handle, process, neutralize and assimilate, making us often find ourselves in the (so common it seems) environment we discussed recently about seemingly knowing how and why all things behave the way they do, and yet not.
So my point is that we can't really help but meme patterns we have not yet grown to realize, and we actually are part of a lot more "games" than we consciously perceive or even care to admit, and those cannot be shaken off until sufficient growth has allowed us to fascilitate a version of ourselves large enough to encompass such patterns. Logically, the automated and self-subsisting algorithmic system of self-redefinition is the best, optimal and it may actually prove only way to go about this, although it seems our systems are not as self-subsisting as we may often think of them to be. If it's of any worth though I can personally guarantee you that that is how the system will ultimately function, once it's structure is optimized enough so it can crash through the Dark Night periods with equally optimum speed and precision. Seems like there is still work for such a system though, even though there certainly are strong indications we are closing on one...If however I prove wrong and you happen to actually hit on such a recursive instant-deification tool that functions purely and independantly of all enviromental factors and assorted pollutions of any kind, please notify me :) . That would be a personal dream of mine come true, and somethnig I have long and hard worked on for many years...a colective Left Hand Path dream come true, come to think of it...hehe...
Kain
Qaexl
09-15-2006, 03:44 AM
I've been working on and off of the collective consciousness/subconscious for a while. There's some interesting (and useful) things I've done, and there's some pretty trivial stuff. Defending against the herd mentality ... in ways, I remember periods of varying emotional reactions to it. I'd like to think I slip out of it ... but it doesn't always happen. I remember posting back on OF, something from Master of Hidden Storehouse -- the sage said, a whale is easy to catch, so he stays in his hermitage and avoids people trying to diefy him.
In reading John Blofeld's Taoist Mysteries and Magic, I'm getting a very good feel for how the Taoist would handle this. Blofeld described the beautiful landscaping these Taoist recluses created. Their Japanese counterparts were the formal Zen gardens and flower arrangement. Blofeld said, the Taoist versions were a lot ... looser, its harmony were more subtle. Things were enhanced by perceiving their potential, and then changed to help what nature might have done in better circumstance. Their temple buildings were built in the same way.
So in regards to the various collectives and memes... I imagine a Taoist would first perceive their essential natures and landscape them ... It certainly goes with the impression I got from the Master of Hidden Storehouse, that in working with a tranquil mind, then tranquil body, you successively expand out into the more subtle realms and the ... zone of tranquility extends far beyond the physical body. Thus a sage living near a village tends to pacify the chaotic karma and ... landscapes them.
Naturally children are in this state already when they come but then they think that they need to move out from it and join the 'adults' lol.
Looking at this from the Mythic cycle perspective -- that is, taking myth as the dream from the collective -- children are initiated into adulthood. Atonement with the Father, Meeting with the Goddess. A hero though, is expected to go beyond the known boundaries of the tribal wisdom, thus the adventure. "Don't go north because they are demons", so you go there because that's where the wisdom is.
When the prime of adulthood starts fading towards death, the elder becomes like a child again.
It is different now though, as the prevailing myths operating in our modern times denies the existance or influence of these mythic cycles... so the hero goes forth to kill the myth (Myth Busters, Randy Foundation, debunkers, scientific skepticism), only to find out he has killed the God of Magic who is his father; so we have "post-modern" philosophers talking about the "existential crisis." Knowing this now, I find this cosmically hilarious.
"He who forgets" (http://qaexl.livejournal.com/150193.html)
He once stole Occam's Razor
and killed the God of Magic.
Faceless now,
he dances on his father's corpse.
He wanders lost in the wasteland,
looking for the Meaning Of Life.
He who forgets (http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/pearljam/nothingman.html),
will be destined to remember.
The emotional system could perhaps use samekind of systems that is already in the body to govern it's own needs. Like hunger for something when it is hungry for, and why not thrist also. Naturally the intaken energy would become neutralized and converted into ones own energy, instead of using the energy as a meme from somewhere else. Everything would be converted to self and then from there project outwards. No external things would exist in the internal.
Got any ideas?
Ha, that's something I've definately been working on for a number of years. It has been slow, gathering up information about the various emotional energies and how people feed upon each other.
Just today during meditation, I finally found the connecting energy between contempt and embarrassment. Both are the two faces of the same energy. A school yard bully intimidates people, often upsetting people through embarrassment and shame. This allows him to be contemptuous. Advice such as ignoring the bully does not work, because the act of ignoring is making oneself feel better by pretending one is better than the bully. Thus, one tries to shift the game in your favor, so one can be contemptuous of the bully. Another example is feeling anxiety from social embarrassment ... then castigating oneself for feeling embarassment. Or giving onself a pep talk, attempting to trivialize the embarassment. Both are forms of contempt, they don't work because the underlying energy (insecurity, fear of loss) is not actually being transmuted.
A good friend of mine was telling me of a Tibetan meditation several weeks ago. Instead of dumping the shadow energies, one pulls it in, burns it into the full-spectrum white light (or mana). Now, I've tried this many times before, but it has generally overwhelmed me into depression. The key part here is that, once the light starts to enamate, you have to allow it to go forth to where it needs to go ... and to let go. Otherwise, the grasping, neediness merely hides shadow energy. Projecting this algorithm forward, I can see how it fills one up into the Void, thus, "living with more shadow to have more light."
In transmuting these shadows, I've noticed that chi is not a very practical for this application. Chi amplifies these energies. "Mana" or "amrita", which is much easier to work with, can easily transmute it to something else. I've been working on daily standing meditation, long enough to physically stress the body. Though I have not been able to consistently do this yet, I have been able to feed mana into stress, and have it converted. It is very much the same kind of process as emotional stress.
I used to have trouble with people pushing their idea of reality onto me, trying to get me to feed them. Ever since I have been switching out circulating chi for mana for a number of processes, this has become less and less imparative. Lately, I've noticed I am far less effected by people's strong emotions. On occasion, for the sake of harmony, I've done a weird sort of evocation ... sorta like twirling the hands to draw out strong, negative emotions from people sitting next to me and grounding them down while feeding it with mana. Since recent means "last week or so", I think I can get much, much better skilled at it.
I've used variants of the above technique for the collective forming my close circle of friends. I generally don't do that unless there the balance was severely upset, and I can only do this while falling asleep anyways.
The thing is though, I do not seek out complete immunity from memes. Being able to occasionally go into "hermit mode" is all right by me, and I've always made it a habit to identify the prevailing memic winds, and then to sharpen my insight to finding stuff that has been overlooked. Beyond that, meddling with other people's karma has always carried the risk that I really should be working on my own.
Omnipotency in this physical dimension can be quite scary.
There's been a couple times deep in trance and working with mana that I get flashes of... holy shit, I really CAN do anything ...
This was before I discovered the Contempt-Embarrassment connection. Now, I wonder what'd happen if transmute my knee-jerk scared-shittless reaction to that...
Logically, the automated and self-subsisting algorithmic system of self-redefinition is the best, optimal and it may actually prove only way to go about this, although it seems our systems are not as self-subsisting as we may often think of them to be. If it's of any worth though I can personally guarantee you that that is how the system will ultimately function, once it's structure is optimized enough so it can crash through the Dark Night periods with equally optimum speed and precision. Seems like there is still work for such a system though, even though there certainly are strong indications we are closing on one...If however I prove wrong and you happen to actually hit on such a recursive instant-deification tool that functions purely and independantly of all enviromental factors and assorted pollutions of any kind, please notify me :) . That would be a personal dream of mine come true, and somethnig I have long and hard worked on for many years...a colective Left Hand Path dream come true, come to think of it...hehe...
Kain
Heheh.
Kain, I hear you with that algorithim. The stuff I've been looking through in the myths seem to suggest that.
At the same time, there's lots of Taoist stories of immortal ascensions that were ... well, instant. Certainly, according to Blofeld, the older generation of Taoists consider the "aeonic immortality" to be pretty much godlike, and while not as cool as complete immersion with the Tao, something a lot of adepts settle for ...
-Qaexl
There are ways to become spiritually dead. Which means to be dead and disconnected from the collectivity of humanity. It offers quite good protection and hiding from the various agencies governing this planet. Going into void itself again seem to be the key. But got so scared the first time I met this complete Void that I didn't get to kill myself completely. A small part still remains 'alive'. It's good because I'm like a ghost walking around energetically. Invisible and unseen. (Except for the small part that I was too afraid to let go)
lol, the solution to all defense is to be healed and healthy. That way one is completely oneself at all times. Which makes one whole, which in turn is a defense against external energies..
Hmm.. Made an investigation of egregore possession going into Church an hour ago. The church has this fine clichy concept with fine 'pure' vibrant astral vibes going on. It was nowhere near connected to this planet at all. When going there it forcefully through the crown made me connect to the egregore, which in turn started making rules on how to feel and think and behave. It's quite scary that there even exists anything like this. Feedback looped to myself with my own 'sins' so that I would break before the egregore. Apparently there are a shitload of souls trapped within this complex, though I'm no expert in the matter as I haven't died yet within a complex like this lol. A main reoccurring theme seem to be to unground the experiencers from their body into this egregore/whatever crap and then start to create new experiences based on the egregore's rules. Of course it's a technique for them to unground from the physical body, as it knows what is best in all cirumstances. To mind comes a phrase from someone who said "I am not this physical body" blah. Perhaps it was meant that "I'm not this mind which is off balance". The body has always told what needs to be done in any situation. Looking at children who are perfectly in the body already, they know quite alot about the spiritual aspect also. So religions have to go.
To mind came a technique where one would simply cut off the imaginary non-physical crown aspect. Doing this on a massive scale would shrug off everyones connection to the egregore and thus free them into themselves and the planet earth again.
In a way it feels like the crown is meant to be a system of emission rather than submission. Whereas the emission through the crown would connect oneself to the Home where one comes from prior to this life. Funny that activating the physical aspect of the crown will also ground oneself right to the physical world with no manipulating energies going around.
A good friend of mine was telling me of a Tibetan meditation several weeks ago. Instead of dumping the shadow energies, one pulls it in, burns it into the full-spectrum white light (or mana). Now, I've tried this many times before, but it has generally overwhelmed me into depression. The key part here is that, once the light starts to enamate, you have to allow it to go forth to where it needs to go ... and to let go. Otherwise, the grasping, neediness merely hides shadow energy. Projecting this algorithm forward, I can see how it fills one up into the Void, thus, "living with more shadow to have more light."
In transmuting these shadows, I've noticed that chi is not a very practical for this application. Chi amplifies these energies. "Mana" or "amrita", which is much easier to work with, can easily transmute it to something else. I've been working on daily standing meditation, long enough to physically stress the body. Though I have not been able to consistently do this yet, I have been able to feed mana into stress, and have it converted. It is very much the same kind of process as emotional stress. This is very interesting Qaexl, and I have noticed this too. I tend to very extensively work with Chi so it has taken quite a toll on me until I realized that it actually tends to amplify such constructs at points! Amrita indeed readily transmutates them, although the process of pinpointing and sufficiently intaking and directing it requires a very good control of Chi (in my experience at least) so I have come to the conclusion that Chi processes should not be subdued in this work, as they are quite essential to it, but be utilized so that a way for Amrita to enter is facilitated.
I used to have trouble with people pushing their idea of reality onto me, trying to get me to feed them. Ever since I have been switching out circulating chi for mana for a number of processes, this has become less and less imparative. Lately, I've noticed I am far less effected by people's strong emotions. On occasion, for the sake of harmony, I've done a weird sort of evocation ... sorta like twirling the hands to draw out strong, negative emotions from people sitting next to me and grounding them down while feeding it with mana. Since recent means "last week or so", I think I can get much, much better skilled at it. This actually resolved a certain internal conflict of sorts for me, so thank you Qaexl. I have been having some never-before-seen subtle enviromental sensitivity and trouble for the past month and a half or so, and this "grounding while feeding them with mana" rang a bell and reminded me of a system factor I had been misusing recently. Subtle, yet very important maneuver...
Heheh.
Kain, I hear you with that algorithim. The stuff I've been looking through in the myths seem to suggest that.Yeah...as we both know and have previously discussed in the past Qaexl, this is pretty much where it all boils down I think...
At the same time, there's lots of Taoist stories of immortal ascensions that were ... well, instant. Certainly, according to Blofeld, the older generation of Taoists consider the "aeonic immortality" to be pretty much godlike, and while not as cool as complete immersion with the Tao, something a lot of adepts settle for ...That's a good point and I think time is not necessarilly relevant to this endeavor...at least it's only relevant in a statistical sense. It certainly takes time to make improvements to one's model of reality, although how much time can greatly differ and can just as well be instant if all the variables are in the correct places. Also, your point about "aeonic immortality" is also very well spotted I think, and quite true...
Kain
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