Rakshasas?

[Marcus_]

Thanks to people like Crowly, Goetia are popular, but have any of you ever evoked one of the Rakshasa? If so, which immaterial species seemed to be the most powerful? Rakshasa, or Goetia?

[m1thr0s]

What, are you kidding me? The Rakshasas rule the entire Sangsaric half of universe itself. They would have ruled Heaven as well but they trashed it and then gave it back. Goetia is a poor cousin at best. Ravana is very closely related to Shiva in many ways. Both are exceedingly distinguished tantric masters...

No contest in my view...but then I never was a huge fan of stand-up gibberish...Goetia bores me personally...if that sounds hostile, perhaps it is, but it isn't directed at anybody in particular. :possessed:

Nice to see somebody thinking about the Rakshasas...they are a powerful force to dwell upon.

m1thr0s

[chaos_mage4]

Wow, I feel like a newbie lol. Can someone please explain what Rakshasas are? I'm sorry if I seem like a burden lol, but if I know what you guys are talking about, then I could possibly help a little. (I meant in the conversation, if someone explains it, then I would here about it for the first time, so I wouldn't be able to provide information about evoking it or anything, but I could possibly carry on a conversation.) I think they are from the Eastern Region, yes? Because of m1thr0s, you said something about Shiva. If not, please correct me.
Thanks,
Christopher

P.S. I agree, this sounds like a cool topic. Of the almost two years I've been on forums dealing with the occult and magick, I've never heard anyone talk about Rakshasas!

[m1thr0s]

Rakshasas make their debut in the Ramayana from ancient India. They are an innumerable race of shape-shifting demons, called the enemies of Vishnu, led by their 10-headed king Ravana. They get a bad rap in western culture owing largely to our own ill-dignified slant on demons. In Hindu mythology, demons are not all "bad"...they are primarily a race of beings (similar in many respects to the Jinn) forced into an uncomfortable competition with humans and gods over territory and natural resources. In Hindu mythology, anyone could attain certain "boons" from Vishnu for noteworthy acts of ascetic accomplishment and the Rakshasas are as powerful as they are according to the tremendous number of these boons (or magickal *powers*, *gifts*, etc) they have attained, primarily owing to their skill in the tantric arts. At one point they became so powerful that they attacked the gods themselves and utterly overthrew them save for a last-ditch repreive attained by Lord Indra (king of the gods) from Vishnu himself that finally drove them off...though in truth they were never militarily defeated but more or less voluntarily withdrew owing to political considerations.

The Rakshasas are especially noted for their industry and their technical prowess. They are generally considered the dominant race of beings ruling over the realm of Sangsara, the polar opposite of Nirvana ruled by gods and men.

m1thr0s

[m1thr0s]

Here's a little blurb on the Rakshasas better than most. You have to bear in mind that they have been villified over the years. Their so-called "cannibalism" for instance is much overstated. If they had really been such cannibals there would be no humans left today as humans were no match for them militarily...

Rakshasa Settlements
During Ramayana period, rakshasa settlements were present in central India and Srilanka. Rakshasas had their own kingdom under the King Ravana with ‘Lanka city’ as the capital, situated over Nuwara Eliya Hills (6.59 N 95.00 E ) of the present Srilanka. Nearly 80,000 rakshasas headed by Ravana’s two brothers ‘Khara’ and ‘Dhushana’, and Ravana’s sister ‘Surpanakha’, settled in the forests (Dandakaranya) of central India. Rakshasas lived up to Mahabharata period, which was nearly 3000 years ago according to some historians.

Lanka city, Capital of rakshasa king Ravana
The Lanka city had well laid roads, road junctions, and impressive buildings. Ravana had magical aircraft (Pushpaka Vimana) which took to destination simply by thought command. It could accommodate any number. Besides this, chariots were also available. He had tight security and big Army, Air force and Navy. Lankini, a rakshasa woman guarded the outer wall of Lanka city. The ancient Lanka city cannot be traced now, unlike Ram’s capital Ayodhya in India. However, ‘Sita waky’ became a tourist place where Ram’s wife Sita was kept under captivity in SriLanka.

Mystical powers
Ravana was a great Sanskrit scholar, ardent devotee of Shiva as a result attained many mystical powers. Evidently, his composition praising Shiva (‘Jhata kataha‘ etc) is well known to many Indians. Hanuman saw Vedic scholars in Lanka. In order to safe gaurd himself from beheading in the hands of enemy he sought blessing from God so that if one head is beheaded by enenmy, another head replaces it . Likewise, ten heads can generate one after another as replacement. Ravana treated God Vishnu as enemy, while his brother Vibhishan was fond of Vishnu, whom he worshipped. Ram and Lakshman as well as Ravana and his son, Meghanath used mystical weapons (astras) during the war. Vedas have secretly described how to vanquish the enemy with fire as weapon. The author has practically seen creation of fire when a Hanuman devotee recited Rig Veda. During Treta Yug (Ramayana period) some humans, rakshasas like Ravana and Vanaras attained mystical powers after long penance, while some others got by birth itself like Ram, Lakshman, Hanuman, Jambavan. Ravana his brother Vibhishan could fly across the sea to India. Ravana and Marichi another rakshasa who did long penance could change their physical form.

Genetically abnormal rakshasas:
Although rakshasas resembled humans, characteristic features, behavioral traits and living conditions varied widely from humans in that era. It is very difficult to say whether they differed in species from humans. Kumbhakarna, Ravana’s brother was unusually big among other rakshasas, like a small hillock. Kabanada who lived in central India had unusually long hands. Kakasur was in the form of a crow. Lanka had many genetically abnormal rakshasas. Some had camel or elephant legs. Hanuman saw rakshasas with single eye, ear, hanging stomach and breasts. He also saw beautiful rakshasas. Such genetically abnormal rakshasas cannot be found now probably because many rakshasas died during the Ramayana war itself and during Mahabharata period. Although exact period is not known of Mahishasur, but the rakshasa was in the form of a buffalo. Evidently, the Mysore city stands on his name in the memory of Goddess, Mahishasura-mardini killing him.

Basically they did not cohabit with the humans. Exception to this has been the case of Vibhishan, Ravan’s brother, who took refuge in Ram and helped him in Ramayana war. Most rakshasas were cannibals. Hiding in forests, they raided villages and hermitages and ate people regularly. Humans could not kill rakshasas because the latter in general were tall and very strong. Bhima who had immense strength killed one such rakshasa lived in Mahabharata period. In exile, Bhima married Hidimbi, a rakshasa woman and had a rakshasa son, Ghatotkaj who lived mostly in forest along with mother and eventually helped father and his Pandava brothers in the great Mahabharata war. Such a marriage alliance between a human and a rakshasa was an exception.

Marriage customs differed from humans. Ravana abducted several young girls of devatas etc and forcibly married. Likewise he abducted Ram’s wife, Sita and kept her in captivity in Lanka city but Ram had to fight the famous Ramayana war to free her. Sita’s abduction was considered immoral by Vibhishan, Ravana’s brother. In this war, rakshasas partook on one side, Ram, Lakshman, countless Vanaras and rukshyas the other side. Vanaras and rukshyas used uprooted trees and big boulders as weaponry.

m1thr0s

[Kain]

Very interesting post m1thr0s! From where is this extract taken?

Kain

[m1thr0s]

WWW Virtual Library - Sri Lanka (http://www.lankalibrary.com/) | pagelink (http://www.lankalibrary.com/cul/raksha.htm)

found it interesting because it gives a little geographical background you don't usually see...

m1thr0s

[Oroc]

Very interesting post. So what happened to those Rakshasas? And how can u evoke them? Never heard of it before.

Oroc

[m1thr0s]

I guess I have never really been into the usual sorts of evokation methods since I find that really dwelling on a particular intelligence is sufficient to evoke its presence for me. But if you wanted to go at it via more classical methods you would probably want to start with a few names and descriptions and then fashion some ritual around a particular character, based upon its known identifiers. The most powerful of the Rakshasas is Ravana, but he might be just a tad dangerous to start with...

I don't know...research, contemplate, innovate...pick your target and hammer down. Since the Rakshasas are known for their tantric prowess, you would probably fare well to utilize as many light & sound parameters as you could put together. Magick is a creative endeavor, afterall...

I would recommend really having your shields in order. Rakshasas aren't dumb and they don't generally like people much. They tend to like them with a little Chianti, if you get my drift...:eek:

m1thr0s

[Oroc]

So another question from a beginner: i really don't know how to evoke or invoke
anything, and know nothing about shielding, grounding, clearing...the only thing I
know is Banishing Ritual...:sad:

So where can I find infos about those techniques? I don't know a thing about tantric systems either, and I'm a bit lost...I surely don't mind doing all the work to get where I want but I dont know where to look. And after evoking a Rakshasa what do I do whit him? :confused:
I might not know a lot about all this but I am a fast learner...Give me a hand please! It's surely a lot of questions, but I hope you can handle it.

Tkx for your time,

Oroc

[Marcus_]

You've evoked some?

How powerful were the ones that you evoked? (if you evoked any)

What percentage of their strength is "genetic"?
Many magick powers are learned, but how fast one can learn, and how much one can learn -- is "genetic" (in earth biol ogical terms).

If any of you have a sigil which connects to a Rakshasa, please post image.

[Marcus_]

So another question from a beginner: i really don't know how to evoke or invoke
anything, and know nothing about shielding, grounding, clearing...the only thing I
know is Banishing Ritual...:sad:

So where can I find infos about those techniques? I don't know a thing about tantric systems either, and I'm a bit lost...I surely don't mind doing all the work to get where I want but I dont know where to look. And after evoking a Rakshasa what do I do whit him? :confused:
I might not know a lot about all this but I am a fast learner...Give me a hand please! It's surely a lot of questions, but I hope you can handle it.

Tkx for your time,

Oroc
I suggest that if you do begin evokations, start off by evoking beings which are not too powerful, and which are "sexy". Make out with them allot. It's great training, and will turn your earthly obsessions into heavenly connections.:cool:

[m1thr0s]

So another question from a beginner: i really don't know how to evoke or invoke anything, and know nothing about shielding, grounding, clearing...the only thing I know is Banishing Ritual...:sad:The only thing Rakshasas really fear is Shiva/Durga. If you can't wield something of that kind of authority I wouldn't mess around with them just yet. At best you would just be wasting your time...at worst you could wind up in a pickle nobody could bail you out of...

But it sounds like you are at the beginning of a long and fascinating road and you have a LOT of choices to make. Read as much as you can...find a study group if possible...I always recommend getting a good foundation in energy work as a starting point and there are choices there as well. If ritual magick interests you, you really should begin by becoming at least knowledgable in the 8 limbs of Yoga and as familiarized as possible in eastern metaphysics. It's a closely guarded secret really that much of western magick actually draws to eastern philosophy which is one of the reasons it has often been regarded as heretical...

But there is SO much more information out there than there used to be...if you really have a strong interest in ritual magick, you have a lot of resources to draw from these days.

m1thr0s

[Marcus_]

But, have you ever summoned any रा॑क्षसः, m1rth0s?

[m1thr0s]

I am a Hermetic Alchemist first and foremost...I do not "summons" per se and I have no interest in this either. What I do is simply call forth a presence as needed and I do this as an integrated part of other energy workings...never as a principal focus. I have too much respect for Ravana to call him idly to no specific purpose other than personal gratification. Rather I may call his presence when a specific issue comes up in Body of Light work that I feel requires his special insights.

In this way I only call upon ANY powers or forces as needed and always with a specific issue at hand. Never just to prove my power as a magician or otherwise command them to do my bidding. This is stupid in my view and I have no need and no respect for this kind of magick. Much damage has been done by great fools who expound this kind of magick. They know less than nothing and they have done a great deal of damage with their ignorance.

So yes...I summons...all the time...but not like you find it in popular magickal books. I also summons Pythagoras, Fu Hsi and others...many others actually...virtually every day.

m1thr0s

[Marcus_]

Ah.

I tend to have an interest in the many immaterial species/races; this is why I was looking for details from other people, about the Rakshasa specie. I'd prefer first-hand experience, over and above classic myth/legend.

[m1thr0s]

well...when you summons in the manner I have proscribed you are already operating at a higher energy level to begin with so you will derive interactions you did not expect just as you would conversing with a friend...they will tell you things you did not know etc...

so in this respect I definitely have first-hand experience... The classic myth/legends only give us an outline. these archetypes would not have come to prominence if they did not already exist internally in some way...on the so-called "dark-side" of consciousness for the mostpart...

there are many creative possibilities. My point with the Rakshasas is that it is best to engage them in something they already excel at. The way to do this is to point them in some tantric direction. You could, for instance, devise a means to engage Ravana in traversing the Tree of Life...he loves that shit and you will get a lot more bang for your buck that way...

this may all be too complicated for many to get though...

m1thr0s

[m1thr0s]

Look...let's talk nuts-and-bolts for a second.
Look at this cats name for cripe's sake...it virtually instructs you how to call him up...

Ra-Va-Na = Triangle, right? Triangle = Fire (in Tatvas)...good start...
But we can go this one better since we also have a direct parallel to the Word of Perfection = AHIHVH, which blows the lid right off and means we can use his name in place of the Word of Perfection itself. In other words...we can build trigrammal energy fields with this cats name! It even contains its own banners: RAVA - RANA - VANA: 3 Grand Divisions with 12 House variations each... Awesome name...also very similar to the Bija Mantras...

note: The Bijas of the five Mahabhutas or great elements, i.e., of the Devatas or the presiding intelligences of the elements, viz., Ether, Air, Fire, Water and Earth, are respectively Ham, Yam, Ram, Vam and Lam. link (http://homepages.compuserve.de/tar294/sast.htm)

If that is too complicated (cuz you don't know what the fuck I am talking about perhaps) you can just use a unicursal hexagram... give me a second and I will come back with a simple graphic example...in the meantime I want to point out a certain tactical intelligence that really only pertains to the more experienced.

Kingpins Rule...they rock and they fucking roll if you can handle yourself. The reason for this is obvious...if you have a Kingpin...you've got its whole kingdom as well. So if you can manage Ravana and not lose your ass over it...you've got the whole Rakshasa race on tap... This means all kinds of things really but it especially implies that you have added that whole inertia to your personal arsenal and can draw upon it as needed...

http://abrahadabra.com/images/ravana01.gif

Ok...so this is a basic unicursal hex application but don't let its simplicity fool you. It's powerful and it can be run in opposite directions and you can bear down on this puppy until your ears bleed and it will just get stronger with every sweep you apply. You should center and ground this thing periodically because it's very strong.

And that's just the beginning. The point I am trying to illustrate is how a tantric summonsing tool works. It calls Ravana to a specific task...not just to some idiotic meet-the-master-magician-me masturbation session that will only piss him off and probably not do you any good anyway. If you are going to play with this stuff...play to its strengths or forget about it in my view...

m1thr0s

[Marcus_]

these archetypes would not have come to prominence if they did not already exist internally in some way...on the so-called "dark-side" of consciousness for the mostpart...

"exist internally"?
Hmm, homefully we are not talking about beings which are interdependent upon a human mind.

I think that the Rakshasas only exist upon and within the interdimensionalities of the earth.

Most of the "demon" archetypes [within human culture] are very wide generalizations about immaterial beings/forces which are aggressive/dangerious/parasitic/predatory.

When I looked online for info about the Rakshasa, in the passed, I mostly got Dungeons&Dragons websites. :( Only a bit of good info, is what I got. I suppose I'll look up some tantric info now, on the web, and hopefully find some specifics...

Ya know of any tantric grimoires online?

[m1thr0s]

The Mind is not so trivial as that...but ALL archetypes share a kind of dual existence in that they lodge in the Collective Mind but also exist independant of any single mind.

I don't know of ANY significant tantric grimoires online...what I am outlining here I am outlining as a matter of universal tantric principle. This stuff works because it cannot NOT work...but the power to put it into action rests with you.

Words are just words save for the energy they can channel...I can give you the phone number, but the call is yours to make...

m1thr0s

[Marcus_]

The Mind is not so trivial as that...but ALL archetypes share a kind of dual existence in that they lodge in the Collective Mind but also exist independant of any single mind.

I don't know of ANY significant tantric grimoires online...what I am outlining here I am outlining as a matter of universal tantric principle. This stuff works because it cannot NOT work...but the power to put it into action rests with you.

Words are just words save for the energy they can channel...I can give you the phone number, but the call is yours to make...

m1thr0s
I know that the cosmos has a consciousness, and I know about universal interconnectivity, but I'll rephrase what I meant:

If humans did not exist, would the Rakshasa become weaker or non-existent?

Ex: Most tulpas die shortly after their creator dies.

Lol, wait a minute, did you edit your other replies? :D
I'm gunnu read the new data.

[m1thr0s]

No...I think I just added the image and some text. I've got several things going on at once here. Why is it so damn busy at 12:30 AM???

If humans did not exist the universe would not be what it is so I don't really know where that puts the Rakshasas but they are essentially a force of Nature so probably would exist in some form or another...

edit: remember that they are counterpole to Vishnu...not humans. They have something to do with Creation itself.

m1thr0s

[m1thr0s]

Before I let this go (for tonite) I wanted to point out that there are some remarkable parallels between Ravana and the Enochian Choronzon...both have a special relationship to 3's and 10's and of course both are Kingpins over profound demonic realms. They are also both Shapeshifters and can assume nearly any shape they wish. I haven't explored it all but there's a lot going on there...just something to keep under your hat...

edit: I am not real keen on Choronzon personally and I am not convinced that he is a legitimate force of Nature as is Ravana. The problem stems from the fact that Dee had a very deliberate agenda...his work was hardly arbitrary which means that much of it could have been deliberately crafted to fit that agenda in a very conscious sort of way. He claims his Enochian stuff was all a transmission but it doesn't read like one to me. It smells of fish, basically. That aside, there still remain some powerful parallels although Dee was no idiot and he may have pulled from Ravana deliberately. He most certainly would have had access to the Ramayana...assuming there was some translation available in his own time. It is vaguely possible that Choronzon classes as one of Ravanas *heads* etc... They don't strike me as equivalent...just similar.

m1thr0s

[Marcus_]

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e378/fruitpooper/RSSsmall.png
^Okay.

A friend made this image.

It is meant to be a tap, an access to Ravana and Satan, both at the same time, one at the opposite side of the other. Etc. 6 points. original star = 90cm tall, 60cm wide.

Ideally, [if you have the means to do this], you'd play a special sound frequency, as you use the sigil:

30Hz, 1dB. + 300Hz, 1dB + 3000Hz, 1dB.
600Hz, 1.5dB. + 6000Hz, 1.5dB.
9000Hz, 3dB.

Play all 6 frequencies at once, triangle wave-shape, or sine, (each has its own effect).

Ofcourse, this is still a work in progress.

Anyone can incorporate numerology into a sound frequency relative to a sigils they design, once/if they get the hang of it.
12:30 AM???
Now it's 4:16am, I'm hardcore.;)


It calls Ravana to a specific task...not just to some idiotic meet-the-master-magician-me masturbation session that will only piss him off and probably not do you any good anyway. If you are going to play with this stuff...play to its strengths or forget about it in my view...

:laugh: :laugh: Ima laughin', maw.:p

[m1thr0s]

Hey...it'll be a cold day in hell before you see me objecting to triangles...lol

Bear in mind that Ravana is a Tantric Master and no goddam lightweight. What this means is that if he can wrangle a way out of the box you are trying to fit him into he will...so that's where we have to really study our prey and know its moves as well as it does...even better...

I swear it's all a kind of amazing psychic martial arts Marcus...this so-called magick stuff. It's because of Will I guess and how it works. We are under fire in this world and so we have to fire back...there's no third option. So we WANT these "dark forces"...we want as many of them as we can gather, but we do have to capture them...it's just how the game is played...it's a noble, dangerous game.

on that note...I'm taking a freaking nap. Fun topic.

m1thr0s

[Kain]

Awesome stuff m1thr0s...I absolutely love the Ravana-specific info you posted earlier :p

Kain

[m1thr0s]

Thanks Kain. A few may wish to protest that "stand-up gibberish" is no worse than "sit-down gibberish" and I will say that I agree with this...in principle only. I am on a sort of mission to restore a proper sense of direct tantric applications in things. That's my main focus at all times in communicating these ideas to others because it's so poorly understood...even by people who have been involved with magick for many years. This lack of understanding has created an annoying condition where people time and time again get the idea that all you need to do to get laid or make money or whatever is draw these silly little symbols, do this silly little ritual, maybe take a few silly little herbal supplements and poof! it just magically happens. :o_O:

But any tantricist knows that these are focusing tools and if you know how to focus already, you are just as well off to go talk to the girl or go apply for the job and just keep on doing your practise as per usual because sometimes these things do and sometimes they don't work together. With a strong tantric *focus* in place at all times, you can just roll with the punches either way...

In dealing with archetypes for the purpose of increasing ones knowledge and/or personal power, there are very useful tantric applications for doing this that are infinitely more diverse and infinitely more powerful that the usual proscribed methods, simply because you don't EVER have to break concentration to deal with these things. Even Crowley failed to fully grasp this and it nearly cost him his life in at least one situation I recall. Some godforms (like Pan for instance) really don't like being toyed with and really are powerful enough to kick your ass over it. But if you call Pan to a specific task and that task is *correct*...is a right and proper task for you to be involved with anyway...this kind of crap will simply never happen. I invoke Pan all the time...I have even had knock down arguments with him over this ot that principle. Not a scratch do I wear from these sessions and in truth, his force is united behind me at this point anyway...that's the REAL point of doing these things at all.

So that's just a little background on all of that...

m1thr0s

[Marcus_]

Hey...it'll be a cold day in hell before you see me objecting to triangles...lol

Bear in mind that Ravana is a Tantric Master and no goddam lightweight. What this means is that if he can wrangle a way out of the box you are trying to fit him into he will...so that's where we have to really study our prey and know its moves as well as it does...even better...

I swear it's all a kind of amazing psychic martial arts Marcus...this so-called magick stuff. It's because of Will I guess and how it works. We are under fire in this world and so we have to fire back...there's no third option. So we WANT these "dark forces"...we want as many of them as we can gather, but we do have to capture them...it's just how the game is played...it's a noble, dangerous game.

on that note...I'm taking a freaking nap. Fun topic.

m1thr0s
With all due respect, I plan no evokation. I just wished to take in the radiating essence/force from the 2 demonic godheads. I don't think: "How can I get him to do something.", I instead think: "How can I personally become capable of what he is capable of?"

"We are under fire in this world and so we fire back..."

From what I've seen, competition for resources tends to only happen when those resources are finite. Terrestrials are dependent upon the finite dimensionalities of the earth, but I think that at the moment when a soul becomes completely independant, its entire paradigm of existance changes [compared to terrans].

Infinite peace is not as far off as some beings would estimate it to be...

[m1thr0s]

well, Hermetic Alchemy is concerned with uniting whole systems, so most of this is purely academic.
My personal rhetoric may be misleading at times. I am a martial sort of temperament in general...

the only *infinite peace* I trust to is strength itself...

m1thr0s

[Marcus_]

well, Hermetic Alchemy is concerned with uniting whole systems, so most of this is purely academic.
My personal rhetoric may be misleading at times. I am a martial sort of temperament in general...

the only *infinite peace* I trust to is strength itself...

m1thr0s
You have learned well.

[Oroc]

Say m1thr0s, I am reading and praticing since last week what I read in a book called Hatha Yoga. About eastern Metaphisics I think I can manage to find good stuff.
My problem is that as much as I read I always know nothing: questions arise but worse than that I can't find pratical things to do. Only Yoga.

I learn very fast: if only u could make me a list of good books to start with some magickal knowledge to pratice, not just theoretical, I would be very glad. It's not that I don't wanna have the work of finding them...it's just that I have so much thirst to understand myself, the Universe and magick, so much need of real experiences so I can fill this screaming hole in my chest...

Please give me a list of books focused in pratical knowledge so I can pratice...I think I'll get mad if I don't start doing it for real. I'll read anything, so for a moment could u be the tutor I never had...?

Another question would be if anyone knows a magick group in Portugal? Never heard of OTO, AA, or any others here in Portugal...Can't find anyone with real knowledge either...I'm kinda lost :o_O:

Peace and hard work,

Oroc

[fr.novumorganum]

Wow, just read this thread for the first time. Thanks M1thr0s; and I'm in full agreement.

[m1thr0s]

Wow, just read this thread for the first time. Thanks M1thr0s; and I'm in full agreement.yeah? kewl...I'm guessing a person needs to have gone a few rounds before they totally get that stuff. The banners bit actually caught me off-guard though to tell you the truth...I only just noticed that...that's pretty big. But the main thing really is to demonstrate a type of process...very similar to but also different than traditional ritual magickal methods. This is pretty much the way I always go about studying godforms or particular archetypes that have caught my interest. I "weave" them into the tapestry so to speak, using their names and/or other means of calling them...I never drop a stitch leaning into them to any great extent but rather draw them to me...or more correctly...to the table itself. And it really works and you can take on the bigshots because being drawn to a very lofty focus that way...they are actually eager to be involved. And if they are not...well...I really don't need their worthless asses then do I...nor does the work itself, so that's puts them in a spot of trouble...not me. This, to my way of thinking, asserts the power and the authority of the Magus...based upon his/her work and nothing else.

I also understand that there may be times and situations in which the classical "stand-up gibberish" actually applies more than the "sit-down" version...I am not oblivious to that. I love diversity. I'm not looking to do away with anything of value. But I also think that it is the tantric applications that are the least understood...so that's pretty much my "pulpit" I guess...at least so long as I see such a tremendous lack of understanding going on there...

m1thr0s

[fr.novumorganum]

Only have a second right now, but it struck me how much your tantric method is very much like the 'upper level' invocation i practice, which is really a dialogue between the godform and me, one where the god works to align with me and me with him.

[m1thr0s]

yes siree (or is it Sri)...that's why they call it High Magick...

you know...you are what you eat and all of that...:eek:

m1thr0s

[fr.novumorganum]

the whole discussion is supporting an idea i've been ruminating over for a while (and remember i'm nowhere as near experienced as thee) that advanced invocatory work (not the stuff in all the manuals) is the real heart of magick (and as uncle al said--hidden in that whole yoga for yahoo lecture series---yoga means union).

[m1thr0s]

there is a principle of physics involved here that is too complex for me to quite know how to explain...

there is a line from Nuit that says:
4. Every number is infinite; there is no difference...and again...
60. My number is 11, as all their numbers who are of us....

It is a great paradox of Nature that what we call Individuality is ultimately squarely planted in Commonality in fact...that our success as Individuals is married, in a sense, to the Whole of which we are an integrated part. In order to realize Perfect Individuality we require adherence to some standard of Perfect Indivisibility or we fail at the level of Context...we achieve individuality only within the confines of a Division of one kind or another.

Thus the highest rungs of magick meld with the highest rungs of physics which people would fear would cost them their Individuality, when in fact this is the only way for them ever to secure it.

The genius of tantricism has always been involved with attacking that physics head-on and achieving "godhead" (if we will) at the level of its form directly...not on the basis of its person, which we simply cannot know in advance of this achievement.

And yet somehow, though this is all perfectly clear when it is clear, it remains incomprehensible prior to some innate awakening to its clarity...and many of the disciplines that have been laid down, have been laid down to facilitate this "unexpected" event...this "chance of union" as it were.

So it's all good...and at the same time...it's all a crock of bullshit. Not malicious or malevolent, but not entirely candid either.

ah well...thus spoke Enigmaticus I guess...:cool:

m1thr0s

[Amur]

Very interesting to read. Triangles are always triangles, and a new opening point mathematically into a new dimension. Of course no one know what the heck is waiting there at the higher dimension, but atleast one can make the hop with a little triangle geometrics. The most dangerous thing for the collective mind, and the idiots who are trying to control this dream of humanity, is a self-subsisting individual with knowledge and wisdom as his/her arsenal. Things get even better when those have means to connect to each other to share their own work and give their own opinions on perfecting matters.

Thank you for the very valuable pieces of information.

From personal experience I must say that I can not emphasize enough on the slowness of evolving. Going too fast will make one insane and can be emotionally very destroying. For some reason I woke up way before I was supposed to and it has caused alot of damage external and internal. A steady and secure boat is needed for deep-exploration. Not a bath-tub with holes, as that is quite suicidal. Deeply esoteric/exoteric kind of information is also best kept to yourself as spilling it out on ppl who do neither deserve nor needs it will only do damage to yourself and to them.May be preaching to the choir here. But just a few points which atleast for me has come punching me right in the face for not following those simple procedures.

[Marcus_]

there is a principle of physics involved here that is too complex for me to quite know how to explain...

there is a line from Nuit that says:
4. Every number is infinite; there is no difference...and again...
60. My number is 11, as all their numbers who are of us....
m1thr0s
I'd say to this:

Math is a tool for prediction.

Any one thing, has and will be infinitely various things, thus it is not actually one thing.

;)

[Marcus_]

Very interesting to read. Triangles are always triangles, and a new opening point mathematically into a new dimension. Of course no one know what the heck is waiting there at the higher dimension, but atleast one can make the hop with a little triangle geometrics. The most dangerous thing for the collective mind, and the idiots who are trying to control this dream of humanity, is a self-subsisting individual with knowledge and wisdom as his/her arsenal. Things get even better when those have means to connect to each other to share their own work and give their own opinions on perfecting matters.

Thank you for the very valuable pieces of information.

From personal experience I must say that I can not emphasize enough on the slowness of evolving. Going too fast will make one insane and can be emotionally very destroying. For some reason I woke up way before I was supposed to and it has caused alot of damage external and internal. A steady and secure boat is needed for deep-exploration. Not a bath-tub with holes, as that is quite suicidal. Deeply esoteric/exoteric kind of information is also best kept to yourself as spilling it out on ppl who do neither deserve nor needs it will only do damage to yourself and to them.May be preaching to the choir here. But just a few points which atleast for me has come punching me right in the face for not following those simple procedures.
Knowledge is like a book.
In and of itself, it is harmless.
It only gets good and bad once somebody wants to cause change with it.

[m1thr0s]

Any one thing, has and will be infinitely various things, thus it is not actually one thing. A platitude in time saves nine? :confused:
Physics and "math" are not quite the same thing Marcus...
Though, in truth, even math is an art form of a "first" kind...
Possibly because the universe itself is inherently artistic.
Not for everyone at the exact same time I think...which is too bad in some ways...

m1thr0s

[Amur]

Knowledge is like a book.
In and of itself, it is harmless.
It only gets good and bad once somebody wants to cause change with it.

That's really the problem in this world. People want to control (like me as I'm deadly afraid of not having control), and when they do so, they steer away from Themselves and their natural instinct. After all the head with the brain doesn't need to be carried along with the shoulders. By surrendering them they carry themselves as the human body was designed as such to keep it's head standing through the spine.

I'm laughed at because of it, but I got afraid when I noticed that I don't need to carry this head up, as it carries itself through the spine quite perfectly already hehe...

[Phoenix]

[quote=Marcus_;3936]http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e378/fruitpooper/RSSsmall.png


I know this image but it doesn´t fit in the hole idea of summoning, where did you get this information?

2 - Do you actualy think that you dont need the circle of embodiment to restrain the energy?

3-Man this is becoming Hard core to the bone, i have only seen one of these many years ago, and it was used to summon a fire spirit...(partial geomancy), as soon as i locate the book i saw it in i will post it here.

[Phoenix]

4 - Do you think that the mithical contrat made by Solomon is still in efect and includes this entities?

:confused:

[m1thr0s]

I don't know Phoenix...I don't personally feel like Solomon means shit to beans to tell you the plainest possible truth. I don't expect that truth to hold for all necessarily but it certainly holds for me. Maybe this needs to be expressed more often as I suspect it holds for a lot more people than would like to admit to it openly.

I am a tantrick alchemist and I know where my assumptions lie. Solomon is nothing in my world and even less in any universe of mine. I can honestly assert without any hesitation...there is no Solomon where I am...

"Different strokes for different folks"...Sly and the Family Stone

m1thr0s

[Amur]

Dunno why I write here. But having control over the demons and Rakshasas seems to be one way in cleaning this planet up. As that is where the gem(s) lie, inside the darkness. Though they need a strong leader who is even worse than what they are, a bandit leader sort-of rofl. If we look from another angle, we could also say that Rakshasa is imbalance and balance is an angel in this psychotic level grin. Then the rakshasa holds the key to the balance as well as the reason to why it is in imbalance, so again the keys are in the pile of crap. Happy hunting folks. :laugh:

If we go look at the various balancings this planet has provided in nature, we might even see quite a masterful balancer between various species and what not networks involved into this planet.

[Aodh]

The Rakshasa-mythology sounds very similar to the djinn mythologies present in Islam in the general sense. A race which is sperate from humans and gods, which can be troublesome in various ways etc.

I think I may just have to proceed with a working involving them soon to try and learn some more about them.

Thanks for the info. :)

[Naomi]

I think that

Goetia = a list of infernal spirits in or nearby the zone girdling the earth

Rakshasa = infernal spirits, general term for big and little ones.

Infernals = Denizens of the inferno or the great abyss which lies just to the left of wherever you are...there's a door.