On Family

[Okazaki Castle]

OK, so we all know monogamy is a latter-day invention, and that other systems of social organization are possible, and to some of us maybe even preferable / more natural. Personally I've always been a fan of hippy-style communes, but in luxury and style, with a variety of international 'communes'. Communal child care very often, so the women can have plenty of time off if they want it, relaxed housing arrangements, people crashing over at friend's places if they feel like it, servants and restaurants and stuff, but also we can cook for friends if we feel like it. And not Hippies but Hippeis - The Spartan Elite 300. People think they can push hippies about cuz they're all 'peace and love' - nobody's stupid enough to try pushing hippeis around though... and servants/slaves sit much better within that context. Likewise, like the old ninja families, proper education of children in fun and useful stuff, like meditation, combat, weapons, and also things like survival skills, socialising, and so on. Kids enjoy that stuff, they just find academic schoolwork realy, really boring. So that's sort of my take on 'ideal family arrangements'. In brief.

But there's other approaches out there too. For example, I found this over on another forum:

* * * * *

Tell me Josie.... what is a woman's responsibility to her husband, and to her children?

Well while this thread is not about me telling you what a woman's responsibility is to her husband and children...I have no problem at all answering it.

I am going to step out of the norm here with today's society only because I am old fashioned. There has to be respect for each other..we are best friends...I personally feel he has a great responsibility in keeping a roof over our heads...as I was a stay at home mom for years...I made sure he or the children never went without hot home cooked meals, clean clothes and environment...food and supplies for the home...and much TLC! I was and am always two steps ahead of him and the children in their needs. I have always been happy doing this...but one thing that cannot be ignored and is there for both to share in the most loving way is knowing each others sexual needs...and exploring those needs in keeping the lovemaking exciting. Hard to do when children demand so much from mom...but it's something so vital and important to a marriage. Love, Friendship and respect and also keep a safe and peaceful environment in the home. Like I stated I am old fashioned and even though it's important to have equality in a marriage...I do not have a problem with my husband being in control...as he is the main bread winner...he carries a lot on his shoulders. I hope I answered your question! This is my personal experience pple so go easy on me LOL

* * * * *

And that sounds cool and fun as well, though never personally tried that sorta thing this lifetime round so don't know how long it would actually hold my interest, but, y'know, it may appeal more to some people...

The one woman thing has always been quite tricky for me, as I fundementally do like sexual variety after a while, though with depth most of that time. But as an ideal or fun system of social organization and from your own personal perspectives, whaddy'all reckon works best on this score?

all the best all,
Oazaki.

[Naomi]

Your closest friends become your family, honestly.

Satan follows the polyamorous model and I don't see why we can't all do the same.

Yet there are boundaries, even in polyamorism. You don't sleep with enemies, as a general rule.

And there's tantric reasons for that.

A big problem with humankind is they treat only their own blood children as important, when they should treat all children the same. They all have the potential at that stage to turn to good...no matter the soul, even. A smart magician wins over the hearts and souls of children to his or her side.

[feranaja]

Since I've never had a man take care of me I can only guess that my thinking it would be great is a grass-being-greener sort of a deal. I'd be happy with being a fulltime wife - I excel at things like cooking, making the place beautiful and so on - and I dont mind being the breadwinner, I have a nice little business going on..what I can't do, is both. For example today? So far, I've done about 6 hours paid work online, then shoveled the driveway, bundled up the dogs, went to; get water, do the banking, groceries, exercise the dogs, get coffee - and then back here, unload the van, start cleaning (vaccuu,m water plants, dishes, feed the zoo) while I continue to work on clients and make dog food do laundry etc etc. (You notice not a lot of posts here from me today past hey nuhad - hey Yset...) Well this lifestyle - to me? sucks, because if I'd had someone to go run those errands and so on, I'd be making twice as much cash, and plus, it's bloody exhausting, it's two jobs in one at the very least.

I don't know ... I have no trouble with monogamy and no problems with openness, each couple has to work out for themself what is best and that can change over time. I've had several longterm relationships with problematic individuals and I now find life easier, despite aforementioned exhaustion, on my own. If I could find a reasonable person I'd be delighted, but I'm not needy, I'm quite ok on my own at least emotionally speaking. The goal is, make enough money to hire people to clean, garden, shovel snow and then I can really smoke, business-wise,a nd I'm sittiing on a goldmine here! Thats probably way more doable than expecting I'll meet a partner...and I do mean partner - at this stage of the game.

I hope that didnt sound cynical. If a partner happens, I'll be extremely pleased. I'm just trying to be sane and not set myself up for disappointment, you know?

I have no problem with conventional relationships as long as the breadwinner isnt on a power trip. Were i to find myself the breadwinner in a love relationship, I would still consider us equal partners. After all, Ive done the household stuff long enough to know, it's a fulltime job too. I just dont assign gender to the roles, but both parties need to fill one or the other. In my life, I've always had to do both - single or not (and usually run a coven or too in my spare time, lol) . Being everything to everyone is just harder as time goes by, whether we like to admit that or not.

Besides - I require someone very special. That's not snobbery either - its self worth talking. I'm no little girl with "issues" who needs to be looked after. Some guys cant handle that - just means, they're not for me.

feranaja

[Kain]

I am moving this to "Casual Conversation" Okazaki, as it seems to be more readily connected with social habits and behavior rather than Esotericism per se (as the main forum, "Philosophia Perennis", is a sub-forum of "Esoterica").

Please continue,

Kain

[Sibylle]

I think it's not only what works for the individual, but what works at the time. I had no problem being single and having convenient relationships with no thought of commitment, but I was neither looking or expecting to find anything different. When I did find him, with no effort, everything changed. We are enough for each other. Enough really sounds like a weak word, in this case.

We like the traditional ways for us, but it's pretty hard to live that way in America. Still, we stick to it as far as possible with my husband being the primary breadwinner. Anything I do to make money feels contrived, and it does not make me feel like a worthwhile person. He and I are of one mind on this - we would rather have less materially than compromise our souls.

Family is what you make it. Love and embrace those you wish to be your family. They may or may not be related. While obligation is, it may or may not be love.

[Okazaki Castle]

Your closest friends become your family, honestly.


Yes I think, and feel, so too. We need to all meet up like a proper family then :) Past social patterns have limited us too long...

hugs,
Seb.

[silentjohn]

1 thousand blisss

[Zaii]

OK, so we all know monogamy is a latter-day invention, and that other systems of social organization are possible, and to some of us maybe even preferable / more natural. Personally I've always been a fan of hippy-style communes, but in luxury and style, with a variety of international 'communes'. Communal child care very often, so the women can have plenty of time off if they want it, relaxed housing arrangements, people crashing over at friend's places if they feel like it, servants and restaurants and stuff, but also we can cook for friends if we feel like it. And not Hippies but Hippeis - The Spartan Elite 300. People think they can push hippies about cuz they're all 'peace and love' - nobody's stupid enough to try pushing hippeis around though... and servants/slaves sit much better within that context. Likewise, like the old ninja families, proper education of children in fun and useful stuff, like meditation, combat, weapons, and also things like survival skills, socialising, and so on. Kids enjoy that stuff, they just find academic schoolwork realy, really boring. So that's sort of my take on 'ideal family arrangements'..

The emphasis is mine, but please clarify what you're talking about.

[Naomi]

The Discovery Channel has a document that addresses the children of old ninja families. It's in volume III of the series Ancient Warriors.

Here is a link to an article on children and ninjutsu for you to peruse:

http://www.bujinkan.cz/pavel/english/articles_hatsumi_sensei_ninja_magazine_ninpo_and_c hildren.htm

"Yotonojutsu is the technique or strategy of using small children in ninpo. One important aspect to remember in the teaching of ninpo to young people is that, as with any art, it is best to start at the youngest age possible; but one must be sure it is being conducted under the proper supervision. "

- Hatsumi

[silentjohn]

A big problem with humankind is they treat only their own blood children as important, when they should treat all children the same. They all have the potential at that stage to turn to good...no matter the soul, even. A smart magician wins over the hearts and souls of children to his or her side.


Well, originaly a couple would mate, generate kids, and then the more experience aunts and uncles of the tribe would raise all the kids... as the younger more virle couple had to continue the tasks of the young lifeblood


I always thought it would be nice to teach yoga vinyasa or the 5 tibetans in elementary school P.E classes, maybe even qi qong... (here in the states, that is)

It would of course make a world of difference though, and we can't be having that ;p:p

[Naomi]

Yeah the kids would love tha ninja crap, too. Can you imagine? Teaching classes kids actually want to learn...

[Zaii]

The Discovery Channel has a document that addresses the children of old ninja families. It's in volume III of the series Ancient Warriors.

Here is a link to an article on children and ninjutsu for you to peruse:

http://www.bujinkan.cz/pavel/english/articles_hatsumi_sensei_ninja_magazine_ninpo_and_c hildren.htm

"Yotonojutsu is the technique or strategy of using small children in ninpo. One important aspect to remember in the teaching of ninpo to young people is that, as with any art, it is best to start at the youngest age possible; but one must be sure it is being conducted under the proper supervision. "

- Hatsumi

I don't really trust anything that comes from the Bujinkan, or any of the other X-kans for that matter. Masaaki Hatsumi is an excellent writer and manages to be very convincing, but as far as the legitimacy of anything he says, that's another matter altogether.

[Naomi]

Care to elaborate?

[Zaii]

It's a whole other subject that I would be glad to discuss, but in short, the Bujinkan teaches largely low-percentage techniques in a non-live fashion, encourages delusion on a rampant scale, is littered with hero worship in the form of hatsumi groupies, and few (if any) of the lineage claims hatsumi makes are legitimate.

Here's a starter: http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=46037

I've had personal experience in the bujinkan and that weighed against the training I've continued to receive from other sources after the fact really opened my eyes to a lot of things.

If you have any questions or anything, PM me.

[Naomi]

Well, yes, you are going to get that in any large and popular organization. Delusion and hero worship are traits of universally fallible humans.

a largely low-percentage technique is...what is that? :\

Really vague statements like 'personal experience" "other sources" and "really opened my eyes" just sounds like your opposition. I think martial artists are all a bunch of tards mostly, so no offense, I probably think the people you don't like in the Bujinkan are also dorks. Equal hate for all. I mean even Okazaki is a big dork when he gets on his "No guns only swords" trip.

No offense. I'm just wondering if you've trained at Honbu or maybe just met Hatsumi in person and he did something that was weird, like lie to you or steal your girlfriend or...something.

It's not like I can just fly to Japan and talk to the guy to get a feel for him so I'd like to hear an opinion from someone who's trained there and soured up on the whole thing.

[Naomi]

Wow ok I just finished that thread you posted.

And it's full of morons...

I don't even know what they were talking about it was just a garbled blur of name calling.

Same old shit...

Martial artist 1: Blah blah blah! My art is the best!
Martial artist 2: Blah?!! Blagh! Lineage blah blah blah

I mean damn, what a bunch of dorks. They need to read GQ and go to the club instead of the dojo.

Maybe you can post a summary or something.

[Zaii]

That's a board that's notorious for flaming and name calling, and if you're saying something perceived as idiotic, you generally get treated as such. Certain forums on the board are deliberately unmoderated to discourage the kind of circle jerk "i'm okay you're okay it doesn't really matter if what we're saying is true" thing that goes on on many message boards. The point was the thread it references on E-budo in the first post. I should have specified. My bad.

Peruse that for more specific details of what I'm getting at.

A low percentage technique (as opposed to a high percentage one) is something that when delivered against a fully resisting opponent (one you would encounter in a real confrontation of some kind and not in a compliant training setting) has a low percentage of actually being successful. Some examples include standing armlocks and wristlocks, most pressure point strikes, the infamous bujinkan lunge punch, so on and so forth.

I have never personally set foot in Hombu or met Hatsumi himself.

I trained at a bujinkan dojo for a year. In that entire time I learned only one technique that was worthwhile, and that was purely by accident. By and large I was taught rigid stancework, non-fluid movement (whilst the entire time the instructor is referencing "flowing like water"), poor striking techniques, and even worse grappling.

Since that time I've trained in a mixed martial arts and Brazilian Jiujutsu program, in addition to cross training with some wrestlers, and my situation is immensely better.

The key difference in the two approaches is Aliveness (http://aliveness101.blogspot.com/2005/07/why-aliveness.html)

[Naomi]

Hmm, ok.

Sounds like you had a shitty instructor. From what I've seen of Taijutsu practitioners the art is very fluid and elegant....but some guys...heh, well they can make the water kata look like a block of wood...others can make it look like a human turning into a tsunami. (I've seen the kata, but keep in mind I don't practice them or try them.)

Link you posted....great. But I don't see how it relates to the Bujinkan other than to form a similarity. Hatsumi has always been very forward thinking, incorporating firearms defense and new ideas into the curriculum, much to the chagrin of historical traditionalists who resent his acknowledgement of the contemporary reality of guns and continuous learning. I find it interesting...and authentic, at least from a militaristic viewpoint.

My impression is that you had a bad experience and let that color your view to the point of extremism.

And things are so different in Japan. (Assuming you havn't trained in Japan) Surely the training there is much better, and with about 100,000+ members worldwide, they can't all be bad instructors. I can name several fuckstains in the Bujinkan off the top of my head....but there's other stories about that and why they exist.

[Zaii]

Hmm, ok.

Sounds like you had a shitty instructor. From what I've seen of Taijutsu practitioners the art is very fluid and elegant....but some guys...heh, well they can make the water kata look like a block of wood...others can make it look like a human turning into a tsunami. (I've seen the kata, but keep in mind I don't practice them or try them.)

Link you posted....great. But I don't see how it relates to the Bujinkan other than to form a similarity. Hatsumi has always been very forward thinking, incorporating firearms defense and new ideas into the curriculum, much to the chagrin of historical traditionalists who resent his acknowledgement of the contemporary reality of guns and continuous learning. I find it interesting...and authentic, at least from a militaristic viewpoint.

My impression is that you had a bad experience and let that color your view to the point of extremism.

And things are so different in Japan. (Assuming you havn't trained in Japan) Surely the training there is much better, and with about 100,000+ members worldwide, they can't all be bad instructors. I can name several fuckstains in the Bujinkan off the top of my head....but there's other stories about that and why they exist.

I've never encountered anything but shitty instructors, and can name ten people off the top of my head who moved on for similar reasons.

It's not so much that the instructors are bad per se, it's that the techniques themselves are.

As far as saying the concept of aliveness is similar to the bujinkan curriculum, I'm not sure if you read the page in its entirety. Everything about the bujinkan, the endless dead drills, the katas, the lack of sparring, and general absence of pressure testing goes against everything the idea of aliveness represents.

It all looks very fluid and coordinated because it's like dancing. There's very little of anything -martial- to the "art".

There may be in excess of 100,000 members world wide, but all that means is that a bunch of people are engaging in a collective live action role playing session and not actually learning martial arts.

Honestly if someone tried to use most of the crap that the bujinkan teaches in a real confrontation, they would A) Look like an idiot, B) Get crippled by anyone with some real grasp of how to hurt a person and not get hurt in the process.

The defense to this, and the justification for not sparring, is that their techniques are "too deadly". Frankly that's a cop out and like a cook saying that he can't allow you to taste test his food because it's too delicious. You as a human being can spar someone and not kill them or put them in the emergency room by exercising just the tiniest bit of caution and courtesy.

I think there's something like two or three people altogether who actually compete and are from the bujinkan, and they all cross train in other arts which are taught with aliveness.

Hatsumi talks a good game and is -very- intelligent. I'm not under any other impression. But it's incredibly simple to talk the talk without having to walk the walk if your skills are never put to the test and if you have a silver tongue, much like he does. While the man himself may be a skilled martial artist (considering his extensive history with judo, for example), the system he is teaching is frankly without much worth in an actual physical confrontation, and the whole ninja gimmick is really an excellent way to cash in on myth, muddled history, and general ignorance. If his books weren't so well written and he didn't have such a presence of personality, it would be easy to see him among the other myriad frauds in the martial arts.

Have you trained in Japan?

[m1thr0s]

this all sounds like a packaging problem to me...that it should perhaps be touted more as a kind of meditation art than a martial art per se...

intelligent dance is certainly good for something...not necessarily good for fighting though...

m1thr0s

[Naomi]

All martial arts are the same. It's about killing people, end of story. There's only so many ways to break the human body. Whether you study Budo Taijutsu or Tae Kwon Do, you're learning how to injure people or kill them. When you call it "the crap the Bujinkan teaches" you betray your lack of experience. Krav Maga has a wristlock. Budo Taijutsu has a wristlock. Tae Kwon Do has a front kick. Budo Taijutsu has a front kick. It's all the SAME SHIT. Just as there are only so many ways to break the human body, there's only so many ways the human body can maneuver.

All martial arts also have their share of bad instructors and lunatics. Hell you can see that other Bujinkan students warn others about certain shady Bujinkan instructors or places. It's nothing new in the modern age to have crappy far flung schools that teach a shoddy version of what's done at the main dojo. (In this case, Honbu)

Now, I didn't say all Budo Taijutsu practitioners looked fluid. Nor did I say the art itself looked like a dance. It doesn't. I watched a school that was mostly army guys --including two rangers with rep. They were like typical American guys to watch. They knew what they were studying was boss. But they tweaked it until it worked -human bodies vary greatly in size and shape and motion. The instructor had great Taijutsu. He could definately kick someone's ass, because we knew he got in fights that came out of various disagreements, (that just being how it is in redneck country) and his movements were precise and effective.

It's not dancelike, as Tae Kwon Do, Kung Fu or Tai Chi is. In fact the kata I mentioned I had to weedle out of one of the students to show me ---they didn't practice it there at all, as it wasn't martial enough. It was a very serious killing-oriented school. I don't want to mince words there. The guys and gals were very honorable and friendly, but they were interested in learning how to kill properly. I tried the elemental kata myself. It is a movement that invokes the elements. I knew that because I work with the elements in a way where I acknowledge their presence and discern between them. It was intriguing. And it is not a dance as you are describing, even. It is more like a simple motion. It is one movement for each element, and short (2-3 seconds)

But back to the topic at hand. Hatsumi isn't trustworthy according to you. You say it's because you had a shitty Bujinkan instructor. You say you found a better instructor in another martial art and are learning something. My question is...this reflects on Hatsumi...how? All martial arts are the same. Sure, if you want to learn good knife fighting, you go to kali. It's all the same. You learn how to kick someone's ass. Hatsumi teaches people how to kick people's asses. Whether your instructor was listening or not when he went to Honbu, I have no idea.

When you take an art that is as old as Budo, you are looking at a thousand years worth of Asian history. I think that if you want to learn how to fight, any martial art will serve you so long as you have a good teacher. Yet if you want to learn how to be a warrior, you will also need a strong foundation. There are a handful of schools that teach the way, in addition to providing combat training. One of these is Aikido, another is Budo Taijutsu.

Hatsumi's words are one of peace. Speaking about love, respect and harmony isn't 'silver-tongued' my friend, it's wise. And I daresay that short lil dude would kick your ass if it came down to it. And Budo Taijutsu is very much a common-sense real world art. There's not a lot of voodoo about it. It's about survival....the ninja the "enduring man".

But don't take my word for it. Why not go into a Bujinkan dojo sometime and challenge the instructor? there's probably a 50/50 chance you'll get a decent warrior. Find out if they can kick your ass or not. Because all of this internet talk is bullshit when it comes to martial arts. You have to rewind it back to the old school to really find out what's real and what's not real. But you're not going to do that, are you? That's way too real life...honestly. That is way too real life.


I don't train in anything. Unless someone jumps me...which actually does happen, from time to time...

I learned butt kicking on the rez playground and my education today comes in the form of surprise pop quizzes every now and then. :laugh:

I would so not be caught dead as a martial artist. I just told you they're SO 'effin dorky.

I'm not going to go back and read your links of 10-20 pages. I think you are trying to kill me with bad boring reading. If you want to convey your idea, do it here. The site was fine...it's stuff that seems pretty obvious to me, but I thought it was ok. If there's something specific there you are trying to tell me as it pertains to why Hatsumi is the lord of lies......feel free to do so.

Otherwise you seem to be trying to make a mountain out of a molehill. It sounds to me like you'd enjoy the Bujinkan, given your philosophical meanderings, but you'd have to give the 150,000 members another chance. :yes: You won't though...because like many martial artists, you're stubborn, egotistical and have the arrogance of a tengu with the protection of the internet. Right?

hahahahahaha!

[Zaii]

I'm not sure what exactly I did to piss you off, nor am I sure why you felt the need to insult me, but if you would be so kind as to hear me out while I address a few things, I'd appreciate it.

All martial arts are the same. The human body is essentially the same from person to person besides obvious weight and frame differences. The same basic ideas work from person to person, but no, not all martial arts are the same. If someone spent two years practicing Aikido, for example, as opposed to two years practicing Muay Thai, they'd end up in a very different position as far as physical conflict and their ability to handle it goes.

It's about killing people, end of story. So people are learning martial arts in this day and age in order to better end other people's lives? I must have missed something.

There's only so many ways to break the human body. Absolutely correct.

Whether you study Budo Taijutsu or Tae Kwon Do, you're learning how to injure people or kill them. This is simply bullshit. In fact, both of those arts are notorious for being belt factories, not sparring, not pressure testing their techniques, not competing, and generally surrounding their teachings with mumbo jumbo and garbage. There are a few Tae Kwon Do schools that participate in something other than lame point sparring, but they're few and far between.

When you call it "the crap the Bujinkan teaches" you betray your lack of experience. Your assumptions about my level of experience are kind of fruitless considering the fact that you say you don't train in anything at all, and you jump to more than a few conclusions considering you've never even met me.

Krav Maga has a wristlock. Budo Taijutsu has a wristlock. Tae Kwon Do has a front kick. Budo Taijutsu has a front kick. It's all the SAME SHIT. Yep, and it all sucks. Any art that doesn't pressure test is crappy for learning how to defend yourself. Period. Again, cooperative drills do not count.


Just as there are only so many ways to break the human body, there's only so many ways the human body can maneuver. Again, true.

All martial arts also have their share of bad instructors and lunatics. Certainly. This is my point. But when it comes to arts that pressure test, it's a hell of a lot harder to fake being a "master" of anything when your students can actually get their hands on you and roll with you in a live situation.

Hell you can see that other Bujinkan students warn others about certain shady Bujinkan instructors or places. It's nothing new in the modern age to have crappy far flung schools that teach a shoddy version of what's done at the main dojo. (In this case, Honbu) If an organization is that fishy, doesn't that make you wonder?

Now, I didn't say all Budo Taijutsu practitioners looked fluid. Nor did I say the art itself looked like a dance. It doesn't. I watched a school that was mostly army guys --including two rangers with rep. Rep? By that you mean shooting people for a living, or what?

The instructor had great Taijutsu. He could definately kick someone's ass, because we knew he got in fights that came out of various disagreements, (that just being how it is in redneck country) and his movements were precise and effective. You knew he got in fights, or you saw him fight? There's a huge difference.

It was a very serious killing-oriented school. Again, "the deadly" argument rears its head.

I tried the elemental kata myself. It is a movement that invokes the elements. I knew that because I work with the elements in a way where I acknowledge their presence and discern between them. It was intriguing. And it is not a dance as you are describing, even. It is more like a simple motion. It is one movement for each element, and short (2-3 seconds) I've been through the elemental kata. They're kata. It's really nothing special.

But back to the topic at hand. Hatsumi isn't trustworthy according to you. You say it's because you had a shitty Bujinkan instructor. No I say that because his claims are largely garbage and you could see that if you had read even the first post of the thread on E-budo I directed you to, by the Greek member.

You say you found a better instructor in another martial art and are learning something. My question is...this reflects on Hatsumi...how? Because he's consciously endorsing the teaching of poor martial art instruction.

All martial arts are the same. Again, bullshit.

Sure, if you want to learn good knife fighting, you go to kali. Kali is pretty tight.

It's all the same. Okay. So this doesn't keep coming up. The individual > delivery system of techniques > "style"

You learn how to kick someone's ass. Hatsumi teaches people how to kick people's asses. By playing with each other doing routine drills with a predetermined uke and tori? When you know for a guarantee which person is going to come out on top at the end of a practice session, something is wrong.

When you take an art that is as old as Budo, you are looking at a thousand years worth of Asian history. There is certainly still excellent martial arts instruction of a traditional fashion, but I am denying that it's in the Bujinkan. Perhaps in some traditional japanese jujutsu schools, judo, etc etc.

I think that if you want to learn how to fight, any martial art will serve you so long as you have a good teacher. I would say that any pressure tested martial art with good instructor will teach you how to better handle yourself. However, Aikido and other magical pants dance dance arts without realistic interaction will not do so.

Yet if you want to learn how to be a warrior, you will also need a strong foundation. I don't claim to be a warrior. Anyone who is not in combat against people trying to kill them is not a warrior. I am not trying to kill people. I am not at war. "Warrior spirit" is a whole other discussion that while maybe being worthwhile pulls a whole other series of delusional trolls out of the woodwork.

There are a handful of schools that teach the way, in addition to providing combat training. One of these is Aikido, another is Budo Taijutsu. Having trained in both of these arts as well as knowing many other people who have, I can attest that they don't.

Hatsumi's words are one of peace. Speaking about love, respect and harmony isn't 'silver-tongued' my friend, it's wise. Like I said, he's a great writer. Though I don't understand why you're endorsing someone who "speaks about love, respect, and harmony" whilst insulting me personally.

And I daresay that short lil dude would kick your ass if it came down to it. Could be the case. He does have years of experience in real arts, such as judo, for example. Then again, he is in his 80's, you have no idea who I am beyond your assumptions about me, and this again is not only rude, but absurd.

And Budo Taijutsu is very much a common-sense real world art. There's not a lot of voodoo about it. It's about survival....the ninja the "enduring man". Yeah. I read the books too. It's a very finely weaved tale. That doesn't make the instruction any less poor.

But don't take my word for it. Why not go into a Bujinkan dojo sometime and challenge the instructor? Great idea. If we're going by this logic, wouldn't you have to do the same thing to me though, since you're making a reference to my "lack of experience" and ignorance?

I would absolutely love to see a bujinkan instructor or high ranking student come out from behind the "too deadly" and "sparring is against our code" blanket and engage in such an act.

Because all of this internet talk is bullshit when it comes to martial arts. You have to rewind it back to the old school to really find out what's real and what's not real. Which is precisely the point of the first site I sent you to, and they schedule regular throwdowns to find out who's who and what's what and test themselves against real opponents. If you had maybe actually read what I sent instead of making assumptions, you might have noticed that.


I don't train in anything. Wait a minute. Then why are you trying to have a conversation with me about martial arts?


I would so not be caught dead as a martial artist. I just told you they're SO 'effin dorky. By and large, sure there's a good share of people with social problems, but considering that you don't train at all, who are you to criticize anyone?

I'm not going to go back and read your links of 10-20 pages. I think you are trying to kill me with bad boring reading. Cute. But, "too long, didn't read" doesn't say anything other than that you're going off of assumptions.


If you want to convey your idea, do it here. I'm trying. It doesn't seem like you're really reading what I'm saying.

If there's something specific there you are trying to tell me as it pertains to why Hatsumi is the lord of lies......feel free to do so. I never said he "the lord of lies", I said he was a good writer and con man.

Otherwise you seem to be trying to make a mountain out of a molehill. It sounds to me like you'd enjoy the Bujinkan, given your philosophical meanderings, but you'd have to give the 150,000 members another chance. :yes: Maybe if I could find some guy who was actually willing to spar and didn't want to play patty cake and slap hands with me.

You won't though...because like many martial artists, you're stubborn, egotistical and have the arrogance of a tengu with the protection of the internet. Right? Again, I don't understand why you feel the need to insult me, as I didn't attack you personally at any point. I have nothing against you personally, and don't appreciate your assumptions.

[Naomi]

Nah I'm just pushing your buttons. Don't be a creampuff.

Just be like a big dog.

"Whatever lady."

Your post looks like the layers of the earth's crust.

You'll get over it.

[Zaii]

Grow up.

[Okazaki Castle]

The emphasis is mine, but please clarify what you're talking about.

Well, as Naomi said: Your closest friends become your family, honestly. A lot of us have felt this way for a long time now. So, a solution was sought to enable us to come together, and connect, and join, and relate, as family. This entailed a redifinition of how family operated, what it consisted in and what it was defined as. For currently, a lot of us have various other family or family-like commitments and further the current paradigm of family valid and more or less possible in society is not of the sort which would work for us all, nor do we find it that desirable.

Now, the big thing about the ninja families' set-up was that the kids are free to go pretty much wherever they choose and do whatever they want, all the while not needing to fear anything and being very safe. That's a big thing in today's society for most, and more importantly from my perspective frees the mothers up to chill more and the kids up to do what they like more, like having adventures, going for walks and stuff where they like, and so on. The reason for this freedom is more esoteric than a matter of physical training. Specifically, we teach them how to meditate and focus from a young age... and then have them doing Mind and Eyes of God from around 8 years and up. That makes them invincible, Takamatsu Senei said so, and so nobody argues and nobody complains. And, of course, as a lot of us are also doing the same thing, we encompass them within that field, and everybody's safe and happy and free.

This comes back to my old motto: Freedom comes to those who take it. It is just more likely that people will take such an option if you provide them with a comfortable, family or family-like set-up within which to do so. That, then, is what I sought to do. Thus, a House was founded, along the lines of the old noble houses of Europe or Japan, The House of Kenshin, presented here in a slightly eliptical image:

http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/8918/kenshinrx6.jpg


The most important thing to note on that chart is the ease of communication it allows for between family members, as evinced by the Venus-Mercury connjunction in quicunx aspect to the ascendant: the dawning of each new day fetches new insights, knowledge and awareness to all family members about each other. This necessarily allows for, and indeed produces, great personal closeness between all family members and also, more importantly, means that all family get to know each other in a real way - as opposed to just the image of what the other thinks you are which is the form of family interaction which characterises most familiy set-ups nowadays. Now, that chart properly belongs in pre-Sekigahara Japan, for it was that battle which really destroyed the way of life in Nippon, due to the ascendancy of that peasant Ieyasu's value structures and modus operandi after that date. So, I moved it to that time period, usually around 1347 in fact.

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/57/presekigaharajapanmv0.jpg


Charts are like gateways and past charts impact upon the present moment (eg people's personal natal charts, which are in the past) by means of the Web surrounding the planet: this comes down to what most people call mass mind, but can more accurately be viewed as the planet's own consciousness and meridian grid structure. This forms a web of interconnected energy lines which extend out into space. Even before my work Earth's 'web' was very big for a planet of its size. Now, that web is much larger, finer, better put together... and allows for Time Compression, Tunnelling and Fixed Time Gates. So, that house we moved thru to the pre-Sekigahara time period, and centred it on Japan. It is like a Family House, with a common surname.

Now, as already covered on the Ningishzidda thread, 'nin' is a combination of the written characters for 'Heart' and 'Sword'. So too is Ken-shin. Thus, by being a member of that House, you access that Way of life and mode of being. And also, due to the way it is all set up, get taken under the tutelage of Hiko Seijuro (http://forums.abrahadabra.com/showthread.php?t=783). Some people would say that ammounts to life presenting you the lessons you need to progress and realize your fuller nature thru the process of the motion of time. However, that is not the understanding I would say dominates in this. Rather, Time - the ongoing forward-motion of life - transforms you into what you need to be to fulfill your destiny in the easiest way possible. This is the Phoenix symbolism/process, which astrologically is ruled by Pluto. It connects thru to the organization known as The Shadowdancers, one of the operational arms of The Zhedhi Order:

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/4656/shadowdancersgeopp7.jpg

The Sun-Pluto conjunction transforms the ego personality when one comes under the influence of that chart. This moves into your conscious awareness, without your having any choice in the matter (due to the hard square angle involved) thru the Jupiter connection. That in turn reprojects outwards via the Venus-Chiron aspect: which is the best alignment there is for having a seemingly charmed life in terms of social success, money and brilliance. Thing is, way that chart works, first you are transformed then, after that, you live the special life. Without further (character) transformation or work being necessary, though one can still engage in such of course should one wish. But the point is the work is all done up front and first sorta thing, allowing for and ensuring that each family member is balanced, self-aware, devloped... and so able to interact harmoniously with the whole in an evolved and self-reliantly powerful way. That way, we can all hang out in close-to perfection, on holiday for the rest of our lives.

More fully, we needed to have the financial needs of things covered also. For this purpose a wider design was moved into place concurrently with all this, whose aim and purpose was in this sphere to take control of the world's banking cartels and operations. The principle in application there is a modified form of Highway Robbery: Your Money or Your Money AND Your Life. That's what I call an ENDOR logic gate. It's why having the ability to kill whoever you choose to target, like the ninja families of old, is not only useful but essential to this form of familial organisation.

As a final explanatory note, Free Will in this system operates thru a series of interconnected and interbranching logic gates. We transmute and modify those, to produce choice sets like the one covered above. Then, we apply these as fits the Time (Shi) and the strategic considerations at play in the overall scope of things. The aim is to all get together, living the sort of life we want. A bit like a luxury Hippy Commune, but very hardcore, and with lots of them worldwide.

Many persons on this forum feel like family to a lot of us, and we would like to interact with them on that basis and connect to them in that way. Hence the placement of various pieces in the scheme of things to allow for that.

all the best,
Oazaki.

[Kuroyagi]

Im very much a family-person, originally: though my genetical family has been dispersed into all directions of the winds (partly by my own doing) I am coming from olde European stock and am subscribing to a more archaic and clan based system of society rather than to modern stochastic conglomerations, I like the pre-Illiad system. I value house rules and subordinates (which shant be me!).

If you want to be my family you have to put up with a lot of crap. ;)

[Okazaki Castle]

Well, I think you'd be cool to have around in a family unit Kuro. Maybe we could pass wives r concubines between each other or something?

I'd also like to add a quote from Angelina Jolie here, who I plan to have in my immediate family also:

"My father and I don’t speak. I don’t hold any anger toward him. I don’t believe that somebody’s family becomes their blood. Because my son’s adopted, and families are earned."

She is so wise...

all the best,
Oazaki.

[Copuldaemon]

What is being asked here exactly. i c the convo going off in 8 different directions at the same time.

What's a womans responsibility to her husband and children-well, children is a no brainer but for the hubby, I say clean, fvck him when he wants, generally obey him for he's the husband-nuff said but on the other hand, put that woman first in your life because 1. she washes your dirty underwear 2. watches your children. 3. puts up with your childish/brutish attitude and 4. stay with you when you're friends wont', understand your weaknesses and love you instead of manipulate, and all that good stuff.

now what i've mentioned is ideal as to the marriage institution but going back 60/40/30 years, people would only marry to fvck without ridicule but such traits aren't a threat in my culture.
I don't see the reason for marrying because it's expensive and you're going to get divorced anyway. it's superficial now, it doesn't serve the social status quo anymore because society has changed.

what i have just written above is common knowledge, so let me speak on family.
my step pop tells me that, and i quote, "you know, it's your peoples that fvck you" and i c that. why, because who else can get close to you.

also, from my experience, life is UNORTHODOXED. you never know who you end up with, who'll be your friend, where you'll end up at, and so forth. hence, never say never.

[feranaja]

Family to me are the people who love me as I am - understand me, forgive my faults because they know they're not perfect either, will deal with me honestly but sensitively, who genuinely like me and "get" me, eccentric little duck that I am - people who understand loyalty and have integrity and let me be me without trying to fix me somehow...all any of us can do is work on ourselves.

I value fairness, loyalty, honesty, integrity and compassion in others and if I get those things from people, they get it back from me. Thats as close to family as I can imagoine. Blood has little to do with it as I can barely comprehend a word either of my parents say, and they are all the blood family I have remaining now.

fera

[Okazaki Castle]

Ah, fera, you're another one I've always considered as close and would want in the family. If it works for you, of course... :)

all the best,
Oazaki.

[hitman777]

Well, there are two types of family. The tight group that grow together and can trust one another to go through some serious shit together. And there is the blood kind. Often the two interrelate. Not always. But there is a lot to say for blood ties. Being closely related to someone makes it more likely that you will either love them or hate them.

[Okazaki Castle]

What about Blood Oaths, ego sworn blood brotherhood or marriage covenants sealed in blood with the intention of the union/connection enduring throughout the incarnative cycle?

How do you feel on these topics hitman? Would such a connection be stronger than blood family do you think? Or stronger in different ways? Depending on the technicalities of the seal of course...

I'd also be interested in any personal memories you might have of this from other times, if any such you do, and what the consequences thereof in this lifetime were for you? Going thru a very simliar scenario myself with a particular girl...

all the best,
Oazaki.

[feranaja]

Ah, fera, you're another one I've always considered as close and would want in the family. If it works for you, of course... :)

all the best,
Oazaki.

I just saw this. you really are very sweet Oazaki. And I am much easier to deal with in person than this troublesome character feranaja. I may be in a spiritual emergency right now and therefore TRYING to zip my gob a bit - but this struck me and I wanted to say, I'm flattered. I need some human contact, from time to time.
<hugs> fera

[Okazaki Castle]

Anything I can assist with?

You're cute too... ;)

hugs back at'ya,
Seb.

[Kuroyagi]

Well, I think you'd be cool to have around in a family unit Kuro. Maybe we could pass wives r concubines between each other or something?

I'd also like to add a quote from Angelina Jolie here, who I plan to have in my immediate family also:

"My father and I don’t speak. I don’t hold any anger toward him. I don’t believe that somebody’s family becomes their blood. Because my son’s adopted, and families are earned."

She is so wise...

all the best,
Oazaki.Yes I like Angelina Jolie, too! Though we may differ about C. Deneuve, but here I am d'accord with feranaja I think, who also likes her: what a nice circle! haha. :)

[feranaja]

It's A) probably just stress and B) another thread I'd imagine. I feel the need for radical changes and for things that demand a lot more of me than I've been able or willing to give in past.

Im also open to the possibility Im just so tired and worn out from bad things happening that I'm sort of losing it, lol...but this really is OT. And I cant imagine "fera's spiritual emergency" makes for interesting reading...

thank you for asking though...
fera

[feranaja]

WHO doesnt like la belle Deneuve??!? What did I miss??

[Kuroyagi]

Well I like her of course!- but when I talked to Oazaki some time ago he said that he didnt like her that much cause (in his opinion) she didnt have enough "fire"...well, chacun à son gout, as I said then, too...:)

[Ci Celli Ddu]

WHO doesnt like la belle Deneuve??!? What did I miss??

Who?

[Okazaki Castle]

It's A) probably just stress and B) another thread I'd imagine. I feel the need for radical changes and for things that demand a lot more of me than I've been able or willing to give in past.

Im also open to the possibility Im just so tired and worn out from bad things happening that I'm sort of losing it, lol...but this really is OT. And I cant imagine "fera's spiritual emergency" makes for interesting reading...


Well, wanting more, provided the right things are desired, is always a good sign: it's how you ascend, by wanting to go beyond the limits whch currently restrict. I could prbbly help with whatever it is if you like, just would take time and you'd still have to go thru the process. But the methodologies do seem to work both quickly and effectively, in the sense that progress is made as fast as the physical body can handle the changes in energetci state, etc.

PM if you'd like to ask for anything along these lines, or just to chat on this if like... :)

Oh and Deneauve, she's pretty, just not really my style in women. From that era I defintely preffered Joan Collins and Sophia Loren. Two women who defintely need to be made 20 or so again, for obvious reasons... Kuroyagi does like the gentler ones though it seems, so that's cool too, just not my tastes really...

hugs,
Seb.

[Okazaki Castle]

Of course, families don't attack each other. But if one were to, would he be considered family still? I don't know, but I think such as these would prbbly involve taking into account all the perspectives of the relevant players in the scenario, and, being quite understanding, as one tends to be with friends and family.

Curiosity has to satisfied amongst friends and family after all, and some things decided. But being slow to realise, that is not appreciated. The harmony of one's house, or wa, is quite paramount after all. And when undue noise continues, one bestirs oneself...

Personally, I think that is rather similar to Don Corleone's philosophy as to how a Family be best administered: firm, understanding, noble, just, but fair.

http://perusio.com/images/don_corleone_perusio.jpg

The fair applying after one due warning has been given, this being family and all... After all, with Family, there are Privildges, and not all things are duly returned...


All the best,
Oazaki.

[Dragon]

Some of the most notorious attacks come from family. There seems to be two kinds of family, those that are by blood, and those that are by choice..but betrayals can come from both. After an attack, in a blood family, the answer seems to be yes, technically. I a chosen family, that seems to be a matter of choice.

[deviadah]

Let me just jump in here and simply add this quote regarding marriage by Emma Goldman:

"The institution of marriage makes a parasite of woman, an absolute dependant. It incapacitates her for life's struggle, annihilates her social consciousness, paralyzes her imagination, and then imposes its gracious protection, which is in reality a snare, a travesty on human charachter."
Why homosexuals yearn for the right to get married I can understand. They want the same rights as everyone else. I imagine, though, that when they do have this right less, hopefully, will get married.

Marriage is not love. Nor does it ensure monogamy.

Love who you will, as many as you wish, keep it open and fuck outside your race!

The more mixed we become the better!

:cool: